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Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Deck Building & Design => Type 1 Deck Advice => Topic started by: Warrior_Monk on December 29, 2012, 03:47:20 PM
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Cards in deck: 56
Lost Souls: 7
Lost Soul (can't be prevented)
Lost Soul (Female Only)
Lost Soul (N.T. only)
Lost Soul (punisher)
Lost Soul (site guard)
Lost Soul (withdraw)
Lost Souls (2-line)
Lamb Dominants: 2
Grapes of Wrath
Son of God
Grim Reaper Dominants: 5
Burial
Christian Martyr
Destruction of Nehushtan
Falling Away
Mayhem
Fortresses: 4
High Places
Philistine Outpost
The Gates of Hell
Zerubbabel's Temple
Multi-Color Sites: 1
The Ends of the Earth
Green Sites: 1
Nazareth
Artifacts: 5
Chariot of Fire
Hezekiah's Signet Ring
Household Idols
Lampstand of the Sanctuary
Magic Charms
White Covenant Cards: 2
Covenant With Death (Brown/Pale Green)
Rain Becomes Dust (Gray)
Gold Covenant Cards: 2
I am Healing
I am Redemption
Multi-Color Heroes: 1
Joiada, Son of Eliashib (Teal)
Silver Heroes: 1
The Angel Under the Oak
Gold Heroes: 4
Moses
Simeon
The Generous Widow
Watchful Servant
Multi-Color Hero Enhancements: 1
Feast of Trumpets
Gold Hero Enhancements: 1
Meeting the Messiah
Gold Evil Characters: 1
Herod Agrippa II
Black Evil Characters: 8
Damsel with Spirit of Divination
Fallen Warrior
Gibeonite Delegates
Goliath
Herod the Great
Philistine Armor Bearer
Simon the Magician
The Twelve-Fingered Giant
Multi-Color Evil Characters: 3
Antiochus Epiphanes IV
The Goat with Horn
The Winged Leopard
Multi-Color Evil Enhancements: 1
Herod's Treachery
Black Evil Enhancements: 6
Abomination of Desolation
Bringing Fear
Joseph in Prison
Land Dispute
Pride of Simon
Wrath of Satan
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So the focus of this deck is simply to slow down your opponent with Naz/HSR/RBD/HHI/CWD and then Bringing Fear/Wrath away all their heroes. I have an A-Bomb focus in there to take out pesky heroes like Joseph/Asher or Gideon/King Hezzy, who are problems, but it's also nice for getting rid of CWD and the like. Comboing it with Mayhem gives loads of control over the game, allowing you to discard something the very turn they put it down/activate it.
The reason I didn't up it to 57 is because I don't need an eighth dominant. Nothing really helps me.
I am very character heavy because the characters are needed for specific strategies. I have two Herods and a Treachery, two magicians and a Charms, two demons and a Gates. These fit in nicely, for the most part, because I can still use black with them. The main thing is that most meta decks don't include an abundance of enhancements, and these, as well as various dominants and the site guard lost soul, will result in them inevitably running out of resources. This is the main core of the defense: stall with these until I can Bringing Fear/Wrath them. Antiochus and Goliath make it very difficult for my opponent to do what they want to do. Overall, it's remarkably effective.
The offense seems very Watchful Servantish, but you'd be surprised how many souls Simeon/Moses can get, and Simeon can also band to a majority of people's offenses. Generous Widow and Joiada allow me to use A-Bomb, which can slowly take out their defense as well.
Overall, this deck has served as a pretty effective anti-meta deck, though I recently dropped some offense to bolster the defense. I've considered dropping Delegates and Fallen Warrior, and I would like to add a Foolish Advice, Devourer, or Overwhelmed by Philistines. Maybe drop TGW for Martha, but I like the CBN advantage, and I can potentially get rid of unneeded herods/magicians.
Thoughts? Questions? Suggestions?
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It seems slow. Even with all the defense, how do you keep up with an opponent's offense?
I know that you have a lot of counters to your opponent's speed, but you have to draw the counters. Wouldn't this be REALLY susceptible to a bad draw?
Also doesn't your own Naz destroy your own Philly Outpost other than discarding itself?
I like the overall idea, I'm just not sure it would work very consistently.
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With 6 counters, I'm pretty likely to get one in the first 8 cards, successfully slowing down my opponent. My offense serves as my primary speed, but for the most part, I just slow down my opponent. So yeah, I could get screwed and not get any of the 6, but that'd be like not drawing dominants for an entire game.
I forgot to mention why I include both Naz and Outpost, which most people think is counter-productive, but it recurs Goliath, and that's all it needs to do. Also, over half of the time I'll draw it before Naz, so I can hold on to Naz if I need to and instead use Outpost.
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signet ring also screws over outpost. so you are screwing over your outpost and the part of your offence that IS speed that lets you draw. I'd take out one for a writ. probabally I would take out the site, since you can switch the ring, and they wil prob. burn destruction on your writ.
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Decks like this are the evolution of turtles.
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signet ring also screws over outpost. so you are screwing over your outpost and the part of your offence that IS speed that lets you draw. I'd take out one for a writ. probabally I would take out the site, since you can switch the ring, and they wil prob. burn destruction on your writ.
HSR only targets opponents' stuff, so outpost is fine there. DoN isn't a factor because A. I have a number of counters, and B. Lampy. Writ would just take up that counter artifact spot. HSR is also particularly useful against Asher, who I have had trouble with.
The site? If you're referring to Naz, no. If you're referring to The Ends of the Earth, it's needed site access for my offense, or else can be used with the Site Guard for extra blockage.
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When I heard Westy was running an ABOMB deck I was curious to the build. Have you been playtesting any new cards in it?
Also maybe Bronze Laver?
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AutO and Delegates are the only cards from the new set, I think. I'm really not sold on Canaanites at all, at least in T1. They're too specific and small just yet for a deck like this. The main thing is it counters new cards like AutO, Isaiah's Call, and Wheel within a Wheel.
I would love to fit in a Bronze Laver.
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I think he means stuff thats about to come out.
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Oh, good point.
I'm not a playtester and have no idea what the new cards look like at this point, nor has any playtester offered to play me on RTS, nor is the deck built against such new set things. So, no.
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With 6 counters, I'm pretty likely to get one in the first 8 cards
My experience is that this will happen more often than you think. I've had decks with twice that many ECs and more often than you would expect, I'll draw my first 8 cards and NOT have an EC.
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With 6 counters, I'm pretty likely to get one in the first 8 cards
My experience is that this will happen more often than you think. I've had decks with twice that many ECs and more often than you would expect, I'll draw my first 8 cards and NOT have an EC.
A. How big was the deck?
B. How fast was the offense?
C. ECs versus counter cards are different. If I get either it's mission accomplished.
D. That hasn't been my experience
E. Shuffle better.
F. Play around it. If you don't have evil characters and you don't have counters, then use your offense.
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A. How big was the deck?
B. How fast was the offense?
C. ECs versus counter cards are different. If I get either it's mission accomplished.
D. That hasn't been my experience
E. Shuffle better.
F. Play around it. If you don't have evil characters and you don't have counters, then use your offense.
A = 63 or 57 cards
B = Extremely slow
C = not really, if you don't get the counters, then you don't really slow your opponent down
D = I'm glad for you
E = I shuffle a lot
F = Again, I didn't really have much of an offense, but this deck doesn't have much of one either.
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I had a 56 card deck(It had 2 Doms, 3 Arts, 7 Souls, 4 Heroes, 5 GEs, 26ish EC's 9 EE's) with 26ish EC's in it and all the time I would get 0 EC's.... Im just really unlucky....
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For the record, I generally beat Westy in speed v. speed games, but he beats me nine times out of ten when he's using this deck and I'm using the Deck. Even if it doesn't look perfect on paper, it does indeed get the job done, especially because the Deck isn't battle-winner heavy at all.
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Question what would you do against a deck with Golgatha and Caeseria Phillipia together??? (something like that)
KingLeo 8)
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Question what would you do against a deck with Golgatha and Caeseria Phillipia together??? (something like that)
KingLeo 8)
Any deck using that is going to be defense-heavy, which means it might come out to a stalemate. The advantage Westy has here is that all of his characters are big, so he can use Generous Widow to rid his opponent of enhancements, then block using characters, meaning he should effectively be able to lock his opponent out. A fast offense will help him get set up faster than most alternative defense-heavy decks, and if all else fails, a well-timed Abom should net him a win every time.
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Question what would you do against a deck with Golgatha and Caeseria Phillipia together??? (something like that)
KingLeo 8)
If somebody at the top tables has that, then props to them for being that high and they deserve to move up for a shot at winning. I'm not playing this deck in the first 3 rounds though, and honestly, I don't expect to see anything other than maybe Pharisees (which generally don't include either), Egyptians, or Magicians. So, no problem.
I don't understand how you guys get draw screwed so often. I only have 9 enhancements, and a couple of supporting cards. Unless my opening hand is I am Healing, I am Redemption, Herod's Treachery, A-Bomb, Wrath, Bringing Fear, Feast, and Meeting the Messiah, I should be okay, and any deck can suffer from such a fate, but the chances are pretty unlikely. If nothing else, I'll be drawing 3 more cards and I'll get something there (or else Z's Temple, Joseph in Prison, and Pride of Simon). But again, any deck can be met with such a worst possible case senario (or else is all characters and still probably not the best). After that I'll have to draw counters or defense, which will be somewhat late, having already given up 2 lost souls. But the same can be said by any deck that uses 8 enhancements and 3 artifacts/fortresses.
The dumb thing about offense is it simply walks in because nobody plays an effective defense anymore. I can quite often win the game without Watchful Servant or A-Bomb (though it is helpful to pick off certain pesky characters).
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OK, I want to try test this deck out. Let's meet Tue night and play online. You use this deck and I'll use the deck that I've been using lately, and we'll see what happens :)
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OK, I want to try test this deck out. Let's meet Tue night and play online. You use this deck and I'll use the deck that I've been using lately, and we'll see what happens :)
I'll do you one better. You load up this deck, and I'll play my other deck.
I know you Prof U--you're probably going to play a turtle, and turtle vs. turtle match ups are neither fun nor likely to happen in a tournament, especially when you size up who's near to you in the rankings to decide what to play.
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I'll do you one better. You load up this deck, and I'll play my other deck.
I actually wasn't planning on playing a turtle this time, since I agree that turtle-vs.-turtle isn't very fun. But how about if we do it both ways. I'll play my non-turtle against this, then I'll play this against your non-turtle, and we'll see what happens :)
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+ 1 for a 56 card turtle. I love trying to come up with decks like this. I've been trying to think of what the most effective 56 card turtle is with the new cards. I think it could be this.
Definitely keep TGW over Martha. TGW can destroy an opponent's hand if they deck out before you.
The one weakness I see is that you only have 4 true battle winners. JiP, Wrath, Treachery, and Magic Charms. I don't include Pride of Simon, since drawing it early usually is a dead card. If your opponent gets two banding chains (to get around Goliath) and you don't have HHI yet, they could get enough freebies to win.