Cactus Game Design Message Boards

These are just my personal rankings. Please feel free to debate them or post your order but please give a reason for why you switch the order in your rankings.

Good

1. Son of God (I/J) - negate and redeem a soul, obviously you win by redeeming souls so this gets a clear first in every category. Negating the soul is a huge lift for SoG which was already the top dog.

2. Son of God - again redeeming souls to win is the key. Thie older versions are not generally as good as the I/J versions but using the old SoG has some interesting combos with the Shuffler lost soul.

3. New Jerusalem - redeem an additional lost soul when played with SoG. 2 souls out of 5 is 40% of the way to a win. The obvious draw back is that it requires you to play SoG simultaneously leading to slight hand clog, and potential for your opponent to underdeck one of the pieces before you get them together.

4. Angel of the Lord - I really debated moving this to 5 and Grapes up to 4 but being able to discard a pesky EC,  possibly with a weapon or charms pushed it over the top for me. The draw back is that protection from discard is probably the most common form of protection on evil characters and many decks are using ways to instead discard these days. However getting to drop the hammer on an EC to win a battle is really solid and again redeeming souls wins games.

5. Grapes of Wrath - Has the same draw backs as angel of the lord in that protection from discard and instead abilities have hurt Grapes. However it is exteremly versatile.  Being able to create a chump block when your behind is huge and has greater value in the balanced decks we are currently seeing.  It also allows you to possible clear a large band of evil characters or Hero's that are giving you trouble.

6. Holy Spirit - this can be vital in some deck types and gives a bonus to several enhancements.  Of all the fruits peace seems like the strongest right now and being able to recur it is solid.

7. Guardian of Your Souls - protecting from Falling away is not a great ability and it can be replaced with Lampstand of the Sanctuary. It also requires you to beat your opponent to Falling away (if they are even playing it)

8. Blinding Light - this is mostly a dominant used for converting Saul to Paul and might have a place in hero-lite/less decks but there are so many ways to convert an EC in territory that it's usually not worth the slot.

9. Glory of the Lord (Promo) - this is another Dom which requires a particular deck type to be viable.  Yes it protects the artifact and the temple but how often is that necessary? There are so many other ways to get Solomon's temple in play and even back from discard. This seems like a t2 card and isn't very viable in T1.

10. Harvest Time - Nazereth and Hezekiahs signet ring both counter this dominant and it requires you to be in a situation where you are being droughted to even play it. Sure being able to drop HT after your opponent uses a SSS or DoU is awesome but how often are you going to have HT when they play one of those and don't have Naz out?  Honestly I find it just sits in your hand most games and eats both a deck and Dom spot..

Combined rankings
1. Son of God (I/j)
2. Son of God
3. New Jerusalem
4. Angel of the Lord
5. Christian Martyr
6. Grapes of Wrath
7. Vain Philosophy
8. Falling Away
9. Mayhem
10. The Holy Spirit
11. Shipwreck
12. Destruction of Nehushtan
13. Guardian of Your Souls
14. Strife
15. Burial
16. Blind Light
17. Glory of the Lord (promo)
18. Harvest Time
19. Doubt

I would personally rank GoYS higher than Holy Spirit simply because it can be used in any deck type. Holy Spirit is only really useful in clay-oriented decks that run several of the Fruits.

I would swap Burial and Strife.

I think shipwreack is beter than mayhem because mayhem is stopped by nazareth and lampstand.

Lampstand actually doesn't stop Mayhem.

Grapes Vs Angel of the Lord I would almost have tied. But the only reason I would have grapes ahead is because of the niche circumstances of where I use it defensively and/or in a multiplayer game stop the person in front of me from getting 5 and then I go on to win.

Quote from: Red Wing on February 08, 2015, 03:06:57 PM

I would swap Burial and Strife.

Quote from: LukeChips on February 08, 2015, 02:44:49 PM

I think shipwreack is beter than mayhem because mayhem is stopped by nazareth and lampstand.

Lampstand actually doesn't stop Mayhem.

How? It protects all cards not in battle?

Not in battle is a specific definition in redemption

Not in Battle
Several Redemption® cards contain special abilities that refer to cards that are “not in battle”. Cards
"not in battle" are cards found in (1) territories, (2) set aside areas, and (3) Lands of Redemption.


Hand is not considered "not in battle"

I would put
7. DofN
8.Burial
9. Shipwreck
10. Mayhem
11. Vain Philosophy
12. Falling Away
13. The Holy Spirit
14. Harvest Time
15. Guardian
16. Strife
The rest same order

Here is the thing. In 12 years of playing I have never played outside of my play group. Everyone who plays is someone I taught or was taught by someone I taught. The point is every play group will have a different order based on their play group. Example: Falling Away is not played much in our group so Guardian basically becomes useless. We all play small decks 50-63 cards so Burial becomes more useful. We don't play much banding so strife is rearly ever used (especially when you have cards like scattered just incase). In other words this is a cool topic but very subjective based on your groups style.

My rankings are just my opinion but my opinion is based on my experience in the larger redemption community.  I have attended the last 3 national tournaments, regionals in multiple areas, and in several state tournaments. I also tend to play a decent amount online which gives me potential access to many areas and play groups. This is basically just to say these rankings aren't based on my particular play group. 

Side note if no one in your group is playing guardian you should play falling away.

Side note if no one in your group is playing guardian you should play falling away.

What about the fact that almost everyone plays lampstand nowadays?

If your running falling away it's easy to include a way or 2 to get rid of Lampstand and not everyone is running lampstand. Although I can speak to that specific play group.

Should you run lamp and FA?

I run herods temple to hold lampstand.

I actually like the idea of Lamp with FA, personally.  When one player puts up a Lamp, if the other player does not have a temple to put it in it is very unlikely that they will activate their own for redundancy when the opportunity cost is not being able to use another artifact.  Thus, the person who is using Lamp can deactivate it at a time of their choosing and still be able to use FA.

That's what I was going to do, but I don't like deactivating arifacts especially lampstand because then my opponent can play DoN shipwreck or cards like that.

But what if you don't want to? Honestly you can always find a question to ask about a question you asked about a question you asked but if you really wanna know test.