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Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Deck Building & Design => Type 1 Deck Advice => Topic started by: browarod on October 25, 2011, 01:58:18 PM
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In lieu of ROOT for Nov/Dec using the Dom Cap, I have need of making DC versions of both my decks. Here is the first.
Cards in deck: 51
Lost Souls: 8
Lost Soul (Beggar)
Lost Soul (Female Only)
Lost Soul (revealer)
Lost Soul (Shut Door)
Lost Soul (Wanderer)
Lost Souls (2-line)
Lost Soul (Shame)
Lost Soul (Hopper)
Lamb Dominants: 4
Angel of the Lord
Grapes of Wrath
New Jerusalem
Son of God
Grim Reaper Dominants: 3
Christian Martyr
Destruction of Nehushtan
Falling Away
Fortresses: 1
Storehouse
Artifacts: 3
Chariot of Fire
Stone Pillar at Bethel
Unholy Writ
Curses: 3
Captured Ark (Crimson)
Given Over to Egypt (Gold)
Unknown Nation (Yellow)
Multi-Color Heroes: 1
Joseph (Blue/Green)
Silver Heroes: 1
Angel at Shur
Blue Heroes: 9
Asher
Benjamin
Eve
Jacob
Judah
Levi
Rachel
Simeon
Zebulun
Multi-Color Hero Enhancements: 1
Seven Years of Plenty (Blue/Evil Gold)
Green Hero Enhancements: 1
Creation of the World
Blue Hero Enhancements: 6
Abraham's Descendant
Answer to Prayer
Forgiveness of Joseph
Joseph Before Pharaoh
Journey to Egypt
Reuben's Torn Clothes
Gold Evil Characters: 4
King of Tyrus
Pharaoh's Baker
Pharaoh's Cupbearer
The Dreaming Pharaoh
Brown Evil Characters: 1
Uzzah
Multi-Color Evil Characters: 2
The Amalekites' Slave
Egyptian Magicians
Gold Evil Enhancements: 3
Failed Objective
Swift Horses
Wonders Forgotten
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To help browarod out here, let's all be civil and not use his thread as a long discussion about the pros and cons of a dom cap.
We don't need anyone throwing a genyptian fit.
;)
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I'd say if you don't get down to 50, then I'd go up to 57, and add another LS, so that you can fit either Guardian or Mayhem in, whichever you prefer. I think that the pros of having an extra dom will usually outweigh the cons of having an extra LS, especially if there was an LS that you wanted to fit in but couldn't. With so many decks nowadays relying on a certain Hero (or one of a couple different Heroes) I find the Shame LS to be nearly a staple.
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@STAMP - Thank you. I do appreciate that you are looking out for me. :P
@ProfAlstad - I like that idea. Shame is the one that sets aside a hero from each territory for some turns, right? I sometimes forget which Lost Soul is which nickname, lol.
So, in light of bumping it to 57, does anyone have suggestions for what 2 cards to add?
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In lieu of ROOT for Nov/Dec using the Dom Cap, I have need of making DC versions of both my decks. Here is the first.
Not sure whether to add 3 cards to go back to 56 or take out 3 to go to 50.
Cards in deck: 53 58
Lost Souls: 8
Lost Soul (whichever one you want)
Lost Soul (Beggar)
Lost Soul (Female Only)
Lost Soul (N.T. only)
Lost Soul (revealer)
Lost Soul (Shut Door)
Lost Soul (Wanderer)
Lost Souls (2-line)
Lamb Dominants: 4 5
Angel of the Lord
Grapes of Wrath
New Jerusalem
Son of God
Guardian unless you prefer Mayhem or Burial
Grim Reaper Dominants: 3
Christian Martyr
Destruction of Nehushtan
Falling Away
Fortresses: 2 3
Pithom
Storehouse
PTR
Sites: 2
Egypt x2
Artifacts: 3
Chariot of Fire
Stone Pillar at Bethel
Unholy Writ
Curses: 3
Captured Ark (Crimson)
Given Over to Egypt (Gold)
Unknown Nation (Yellow)
Multi-Color Heroes: 1
Joseph (Blue/Green)
Silver Heroes: 1
Angel at Shur
Blue Heroes: 9 10
Asher
Benjamin
Eve
Jacob
Judah
Levi
Rachel
Simeon
Zebulun
Abram/Abraham to negate NT & Female only LSs
Multi-Color Hero Enhancements: 1
Seven Years of Plenty (Blue/Evil Gold)
Green Hero Enhancements: 1
Creation of the World
Blue Hero Enhancements: 7 8
Numerous as the Stars
Abraham's Descendant
Abraham's Servant to Ur
Answer to Prayer
Forgiveness of Joseph
Joseph Before Pharaoh
Journey to Egypt
Reuben's Torn Clothes
Gold Evil Characters: 4 6
Egyptian Horseman
Egyptian Charioteers
King of Tyrus
Pharaoh's Baker
Pharaoh's Cupbearer
The Dreaming Pharaoh
Brown Evil Characters: 1
Uzzah
Multi-Color Evil Characters: 2
The Amalekites' Slave
Egyptian Magicians
Gold Evil Enhancements: 4 6
Enslaved by Egypt
Egyptian Chariots and Horses
Evil Spirit
Failed Objective
Swift Horses
Wonders Forgotten
Unless I miscounted, that's 58
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Unless I miscounted, that's 58
You very much miscounted. Your list is 64 cards. Did you mean to take some stuff out when you added other stuff? lol
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Unless I miscounted, that's 58
You very much miscounted. Your list is 64 cards. Did you mean to take some stuff out when you added other stuff? lol
:doh: Sorry about that. Just add in Egypt, Abram, and Enslaved by Egypt.
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I don't necessarily see the benefit of Abraham. I have Wanderer to swap for the NT-only, not to mention TAS and Cupbearer to generate Souls I have access to, and Eve/Rachel for Female-only access. Also, I'd have to use Abram twice before I'd even get that benefit (I'd much rather use Ben or Joe for CBN battle wins or Rachel+Joseph+AaS for protection against dom/art blocks).
Enslaved by Egypt is a maybe, I just don't know that I'd want to have to rely on getting the site before I could use it.
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I don't necessarily see the benefit of Abraham. I have Wanderer to swap for the NT-only, not to mention TAS and Cupbearer to generate Souls I have access to, and Eve/Rachel for Female-only access. Not to mention I'd have to use Abram twice before I'd even get that benefit (I'd much rather use Ben or Joe for CBN battle wins or Rachel+Joseph+AaS for protection against dom/art blocks).
Enslaved by Egypt is a maybe, I just don't know that I'd want to have to rely on getting the site before I could use it.
Once you use Wonders Forgotten, FO, and Uzzah your opponent will be able to stop the rest of your defense, so if not Enslaved by Egypt, then maybe another battle winner. With Abram I can see your logic, but you never know when you'll need another hero, especially in a big(ger) deck or if you get a bad draw. Not to mention NoN with Abes servant
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If this deck hasn't won by the time I use WF, FO, Uzzah, CM, and Writ for blocks then there's something more seriously wrong with it than not having another CBN evil enhancement, lol.
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If this deck hasn't won by the time I use WF, FO, Uzzah, CM, and Writ for blocks then there's something more seriously wrong with it than not having another CBN evil enhancement, lol.
Have you been able to win that quickly? CM & Writ do nothing to things like Sam, TGT bands, things like Philip and Bartholemew banded, and a lot of other combos. I doubt another CBN battle winner could hurt.
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We don't need anyone throwing a genyptian fit.
I saw what you did there :)
As for the general idea of whether to include the extra dominants, it seems to me that it's not worth making the deck bigger. With people playing with less dominants, there will be a lot of people taking Falling Away out of their decks, which makes GoYS likely to be a useless card. And more people will be playing Lampstand (to compensate for their evil doms that they removed). This will likely make Falling Away and Burial to be useless cards as well.
So if you take out all 3 of those Doms (which probably gets you to the Dom Cap anyway), then you could just take out 3 more cards and be at 50. This seems preferable to having 8 more cards slowing down your deck, just so you can get that 1 more dominant that isn't even likely to work.
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ProfU's recommending speed? 2012 comes early!
/or Harold Camping comes late. Take your pick.
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50 or 57 is a big choice. The upside to 50 is obviously maxing out your speed. However, with 4 fewer Doms in your arsenal, the extra speed may or may not be as huge of an issue. SoG/NJ, AotL, CM, Grapes, Mayhem and Harvest Time is solid, but losing Falling Away and GoyS can potentially hurt your speed by 2 turns, and losing DoN can cause you to lose a turn to Writ or to be powerless to stop a Hur+Gifts. 3 turns lost is huge with speed.
On the other hand, adding 7 cards adds 1 dom and 1 LS, so you're only going up 5 cards. While that does equate almost 2 turns more of drawing, you can use some of those 5 cards for additional soul gen and swap out HT for GoyS, FA or DoN, mitigating 3 of the extra cards. The other cards can be used to add more autoblocks or more speed, essentially canceling out the negative. The downside is that you're less likely to get the all-powerful FTM, and slightly more vulnerable to luck (which can be mitigated by effective use of the 5 extra cards), and will also have a lot more LS's out by ratio, lessening your chance of pulling the best defense.
Overall I favor 57, but time will tell.
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So since I'm already planning on 57, do you have a suggestion for the last 2 cards? lol
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Dan and Egyptian Horses.
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I'd put the Hopper in as one. While I was initially not a fan of the hopper following the release of the FBTN soul, in addition to the other ways where it can end up as an LS in your LoB, I realized 2 things:
-Even if it gets caught by FBTN, it's still speeding your deck up by 1
-Even if it gets caught by FBTN, your opponent likely has soul gen in his/her deck anyway, so having extra LS's to rescue doesn't make a huge difference.
-Everyone else uses Hopper, which reduces the number of people using the FBTN LS.
As to the other, I don't know why Dan isn't here. Genesis has limited drawing and is fast mostly because of searches/Eve. But that doesn't mean that drawing is bad. And even if you don't want to draw for some reason, he can make your opponent discard 1. That can be very helpful when done right.
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I used to have Dan in here, but he was suggested to get the boot for the normal, non-cap version of this deck. I am perfectly willing to put him back in.
I also like the idea of Hopper, though I'll probably experiment with Pol's suggestion of Egyptian Horses, too.
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ProfU's recommending speed? 2012 comes early!
I may personally dislike the prevalence of speed decks in the game. However, Geneptians is inherently a speed concept, and therefore my recommendation is specific to this deck style.
As for 50 vs. 57, Pol has some good points, but again I feel like Geneptians specifically mitigates them already.
1 - He talks of the need for Harvest Time and the slow down of Unholy Writ by leaving out DoN. However, Geneptians already has +3 LS generation, and doesn't need the Harvest Time, therefore DoN is the better way to go, and UW ceases to be a problem again.
2 - He talks of losing GoYS slowing down by a turn because of your opp's FA, but again, in a Dom Cap environment a lot of people will be dropping that, and even if they keep it, Geneptians will probably win before they draw it.
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So, other than a Dom and a Soul, what other cards would you take out to get to 50?
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So, other than a Dom and a Soul, what other cards would you take out to get to 50?
Personally, I would take out:
GoYS (reasons already mentioned)
FA (reasons already mentioned)
Unholy Writ (too much protection from capture)
Dan (as before, he is the weakest of the Gen heroes)
Evil Spirit (won't work on demons)
Uzzah (too often prevented by TSA, Centurions, etc., and he's off-brigade)
NT only LS (too many people playing TGT, Centurions, TSA, etc., and you can't take it defensively with your SoG)
Hopper LS (again, you're already +3 LS gen, you don't need this unless the new SoG/NJ rule happens, and that isn't being played this month)
And I would put in:
Mayhem - every speed deck needs it, especially if it's only 50 cards (increasing your chance of FTM), and especially if its a deck that can easily empty it's hand into Storehouse and wants to for Zeb's sake.
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If you're going down to 50 I mostly agree with those suggestions, except that you'd be mad to take out Uzzah and Hopper needs to be in any 50 card deck for the +1, soul generation notwithstanding.
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If you're going down to 50 I mostly agree with those suggestions, except that you'd be mad to take out Uzzah
Uzzah was the hardest cut for me to suggest, but I just didn't see anything that I'd rather take out. Do you have another suggestion?
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Pithom, Captured Ark, or ASU. In fact, I'd take all 3 of those out and leave in UW.
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Alright, I made an update:
-GoYS
-NT-only LS
-ASU
-Evil Spirit
-Dan
I don't know that I want to take out Pithom since then I'll have all these curses and only one place to activate them, unless I also take out one or more of the curses (other than Captured Ark, which I'm not sure why you want me to take out). I never use Mayhem in decks for personal reasons, but if I decide to change my mind I will swap FA out for it. Is 3 evil enhancements really enough? I understand that Uzzah is another battle winner, I just don't necessarily see it lasting long. And, while I understand that Genesis is supposed to be fast so if I haven't won by then there's a problem, I prefer to have backups in decks that I build.
If I was going to take out Pithom, which of the 2 gold curses should go with it? I'm thinking GOtE since I wouldn't necessarily want that eating up my art slot every turn just to mill my opponent.
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GotE is a soul prospector, so not that. Captured Ark is the most overrated card in Redemption, but it's your deck. If you want to leave Captured Ark I'd just leave Pithom.
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Well, Captured Ark can't go in Pithom (it holds gold curses only), so I'm not necessarily opposed to taking Pithom out. I don't know, I've found good use of Captured Ark many times, which is why I'm hesitant to take it out.
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My other beef with Pithom is that it's a loose cannon. Sure, most of the time you discard something nice and occasionally discard a Dom or other really good topdeck, but having it in the deck gives you a chance of soul-locking yourself. It's a slight chance, but if there's a card that can potentially cause me to lose, I'll tend to leave it out of my deck.
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Like I said before, I'm more mulling over your suggestion to take Ark out than Pithom. I'm fine with removing Pithom if it makes the deck better.
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My other beef with Pithom is that it's a loose cannon.
This is true. Of course with a +3 LS creating deck, it's not likely that you'll get locked out but it is occasionally frustrating when Pithom takes out a LS.
If you wanted to take out the deck discard stuff, I could see taking out Pithom and GotE both. That would leave room for Uzzah and UW. Losing a bit of fun variety with the deck as well as random nastiness for 2 boring but relatively safe battle winners.
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I'm inclined to take out Pithom, but GOtE seems like a nice card since it can fetch a Soul or mill cards. Plus, I'm still 1 over 50.