Author Topic: What do you consider staple cards now? (Read 12884 times)

TheJaylor · « **Reply #25 on:** October 06, 2010, 10:39:07 PM »

Haman's Gallows is greatness.

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #26 on:** October 06, 2010, 11:38:20 PM »

Um, I think the professor may be a little confused about the Arts. I've seen fewer and fewer people using Captured Ark because of Nazareth, and I'm sure it's dipped below 90% by now. I also rarely see Covenant of Noah, and CoM I'd say is more 50/50. I've also seen fewer and fewer people using Hopper because of the FbtN LS, and that has also dipped below 90% imo.

Master KChief · « **Reply #27 on:** October 06, 2010, 11:47:11 PM »

agreed. but i do think many people are still using cap'd ark despite nazareth. nazareth first appeared as a totally awesome card, but after putting it in practice extensively, the anti-searching really does cripple alot of decks (and other search staples), so i dont think people will be using it as much as first anticipated. i've seen fbtn lost soul being used ALOT, so much so that yes, putting hopper into a deck is a huge risk and could end up not only being a dead card, but an extra soul to rescue from you.

3-Liner And Bags Of Chips · « **Reply #28 on:** October 06, 2010, 11:54:25 PM »

Quote from: stefferweffer on October 06, 2010, 05:30:25 PM

Sorry for my earlier confusion about the "Site Guard" lost soul. I was confusing it with "Color Guard". In this regard I agree that using "Site Guard" with a multi-color site could be fun. Thanks.

SHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #29 on:** October 07, 2010, 01:51:38 PM »

Quote from: Red on October 06, 2010, 10:08:06 PM

Prof you don't use Mayhem?

Only in offense-heavy decks. and I usually don't play those. But most other people do.

Quote from: Minister Polarius on October 06, 2010, 11:38:20 PM

I've seen fewer and fewer people using Captured Ark because of Nazareth, and I'm sure it's dipped below 90% by now.

This maybe true. As I said, I haven't played enough games with or against the new sites to see their impact yet.

Quote from: Minister Polarius on October 06, 2010, 11:38:20 PM

I also rarely see Covenant of Noah, and CoM I'd say is more 50/50.

I agree that I rarely see CoN, but I maintain that it would still be helpful in 90% of decks. It can be used to win a battle by negating many common EEs that aren't CBN. It can be used to stop commonly used placed EEs like Abom or that orange or brown EE that stops heroes and fortresses. It can suck in a DoN so that other arts are safe. It can die for Uzzah to get a stop. It just seems to be helpful every game that I have it.

As for CoM, it stops all my opponent's SAs, that is totally awesome. And to get rid of it they almost always lose either a dom or 2 GEs (because they want to save their DoN), and that can slow down an offense a surprising amount.

Quote from: Minister Polarius on October 06, 2010, 11:38:20 PM

I've also seen fewer and fewer people using Hopper because of the FbtN LS, and that has also dipped below 90% imo.

This also maybe true. I've played a few decks with the FbtN LS, but so far it hasn't been a problem with the Hopper. However, if it became a problem more than a few times, then I agree that I'd probably drop it out.

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #30 on:** October 07, 2010, 01:58:01 PM »

Another thing to consider with Hopper V. FbtN is if you use Hopper, you can't use FbtN, and a lot of decks are sped up more by FbtN stopping Shuffler shenanigans than buy producing a soul that HT could produce more reliably.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #31 on:** October 07, 2010, 02:12:13 PM »

So it looks like there are fewer staples now thanks to Disciples. I hate anti-search.

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #32 on:** October 07, 2010, 02:31:43 PM »

<3 Nazareth ^_^

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #33 on:** October 09, 2010, 12:37:20 AM »

Mayhem should go in every deck imo. Defense heavy, offensive heavy, characterless....

Mayhem is the third best card in the game imo, beaten by the obvious Son of God and Eleazar's Sword.

adotson85 · « **Reply #34 on:** October 09, 2010, 12:43:53 AM »

Quote from: Rawrlolsauce! on October 09, 2010, 12:37:20 AM

Mayhem should go in every deck imo. Defense heavy, offensive heavy, characterless....

Mayhem is the third best card in the game imo, beaten by the obvious Son of God and Eleazar's Sword.

I would almost agree with this pre-Nazareth.

browarod · « **Reply #35 on:** October 09, 2010, 01:41:18 AM »

Quote from: Rawrlolsauce! on October 09, 2010, 12:37:20 AM

Mayhem should go in every deck imo. Defense heavy, offensive heavy, characterless....

Mayhem is the third best card in the game imo, beaten by the obvious Son of God and Eleazar's Sword.

I would actually disagree. I've never found Mayhem useful. At best it shuffles some good cards your opponent was holding for some bad ones and does the opposite for you. It's too chancy. Maybe I'm just a stickler for consistency, idk, but I rarely, if ever, put Mayhem in any deck. Cards that have a predictable outcome and can be relied on to reach that outcome > Mayhem.

Master KChief · « **Reply #36 on:** October 09, 2010, 01:46:58 AM »

mayhem is the most powerful card-drawer in the game. many many many games have been won and lost because of it.

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #37 on:** October 09, 2010, 01:47:45 AM »

It often reduces your opponent's hand size by 5+ cards while increasing yours.

browarod · « **Reply #38 on:** October 09, 2010, 01:53:06 AM »

Quote from: Rawrlolsauce! on October 09, 2010, 01:47:45 AM

It often reduces your opponent's hand size by 5+ cards while increasing yours.

Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 01:41:18 AM

At best it shuffles some good cards your opponent was holding for some bad ones and does the opposite for you.

Quote from: Master KChief on October 09, 2010, 01:46:58 AM

mayhem is the most powerful card-drawer in the game. many many many games have been won and lost because of it.

Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 01:41:18 AM

It's too chancy.......Cards that have a predictable outcome and can be relied on to reach that outcome > Mayhem.

Master KChief · « **Reply #39 on:** October 09, 2010, 01:55:37 AM »

Quote from: Rawrlolsauce! on October 09, 2010, 01:47:45 AM

It often reduces your opponent's hand size by 5+ cards while increasing yours.

exactly. i have seen many games pre-determined from the 2nd turn when the 1st player empties his hand except for mayhem and drops it after his opponents draw, which usually results in an 11 card swing. very hard to recover from that.

Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 01:53:06 AM

Quote from: Rawrlolsauce! on October 09, 2010, 01:47:45 AM
It often reduces your opponent's hand size by 5+ cards while increasing yours.
Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 01:41:18 AM
At best it shuffles some good cards your opponent was holding for some bad ones and does the opposite for you.

Quote from: Master KChief on October 09, 2010, 01:46:58 AM
mayhem is the most powerful card-drawer in the game. many many many games have been won and lost because of it.
Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 01:41:18 AM
It's too chancy.......Cards that have a predictable outcome and can be relied on to reach that outcome > Mayhem.

its clear you have not witnessed the brokensauce of mayhem from last season. its not about 'chance' or 'predictability'...its about sheer card advantage, which is true for 99% of ccg's out there.

browarod · « **Reply #40 on:** October 09, 2010, 01:58:25 AM »

6 good cards > 11 mediocre cards. And that's true for 99% of ccg's out there.

I've had opponents drop Mayhem after I draw and I've ended up with such a better hand than I had before that I end up winning that turn or the next. It's inconsistent at best, regardless of card advantage.

lightningninja · « **Reply #41 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:00:45 AM »

11 cards to 6 is ALWAYS better. If you get mediocre cards and they get good cards, you built your deck wrong.

Master KChief · « **Reply #42 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:01:58 AM »

Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 01:58:25 AM

6 good cards > 11 mediocre cards. And that's true for 99% of ccg's out there.

I've had opponents drop Mayhem after I draw and I've ended up with such a better hand than I had before that I end up winning that turn or the next. It's inconsistent at best, regardless of card advantage.

where are you getting this mediocrity from? if every card in your deck is good, then how is 11 good cards not > than 6 good cards?

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #43 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:05:22 AM »

If you're confident your deck building skills are on par with your opponents, Mayhem will help you almost every time. There are only rare occasions where Mayhem hurts you (assuming you play it correctly), and the same could be said about every other card.

browarod · « **Reply #44 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:06:16 AM »

Any good card can be mediocre given certain circumstances, it all depends on the situation. If my opponent has UW up and I only have 1 hero with no DoN, then drawing DoN or a hero band in that 6 cards would make those 6 much better for that situation than whatever 11 I had before.

Master KChief · « **Reply #45 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:08:07 AM »

this is also not to say anything of the various other applications mayhem can be used in as well. extra harvest time anyone?

Quote from: browarod on October 09, 2010, 02:06:16 AM

Any good card can be mediocre given certain circumstances, it all depends on the situation. If my opponent has UW up and I only have 1 hero with no DoN, then drawing DoN or a hero band in that 6 cards would make those 6 much better for that situation than whatever 11 I had before.

with a properly built deck you minimize the chances of circumstances not being in your favor. at the very worse mayhem allows you to be ahead of your draw by 2 entire draws. whats not to like about getting a brand spankin new hand full of cards when you have no hand because you used it all?

browarod · « **Reply #46 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:09:31 AM »

I'm not saying you shouldn't use it if you want to, I'm merely pointing out that it's inconsistent and I prefer consistency. You can put whatever you want in your deck, and I'll do the same.

Quote from: Master KChief on October 09, 2010, 02:08:07 AM

with a properly built deck you minimize the chances of circumstances not being in your favor. at the very worse mayhem allows you to be ahead of your draw by 2 entire draws. whats not to like about getting a brand spankin new hand full of cards when you have no hand because you used it all?

With a properly built deck, it's actually relatively difficult to empty your hand, given that it's generally accepted that you have the same number of enhancements as you have characters. You're just as likely to have a hand full of enhancements when you draw Mayhem as a hand full of things you can put onto the FoP, especially since you keep enhancements in hand longer than other cards (usually). Maybe it's just the kind of decks I use, but I don't frequently "use it all" in my hand.

Master KChief · « **Reply #47 on:** October 09, 2010, 02:15:01 AM »

and im just pointing out that what you confuse with 'inconsistent' is actually 'random'. when every card in your deck is uber-awesome, then mayhem can do nothing more than pay off.

The Guardian · « **Reply #48 on:** October 09, 2010, 03:46:56 AM »

I think it's just a matter of personal opinion. I have not used Mayhem all that much since it came out. The only type of deck I've consistently used it in is T1 MP decks as an additional way to get LSs on the table. Maybe I just need to try it out some more.

Right now I think the only cards I consider staples are SoG, AotL, Grapes and Martyr. New Jerusalem is pretty close but there's a few types of decks I can think of where I wouldn't bother with it. I also have one or two decks without Grapes currently but that's due to not having enough copies yet.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #49 on:** October 09, 2010, 11:10:33 AM »

Yeah, the most obnoxious use of Mayhem is playing it JUST after the opponent draws 3. I always hate when that happens to me on my first draw.

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Author Topic: What do you consider staple cards now? (Read 12884 times)

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