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Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Redemption® Resources and Thinktank => Strategies and Combos => Topic started by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 01:55:51 PM

Title: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 01:55:51 PM
Is there a way to protect a human hero from being shuffled by grapes? I've looked around and I can't find much. :/
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Red Dragon Thorn on January 25, 2011, 01:56:35 PM
That's because there isn't much :) For good reason :)
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 02:03:57 PM
I have a good reason.. :(
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: The Guardian on January 25, 2011, 02:07:38 PM
I have a good reason.. :(

We don't doubt that, however if there was a way to protect Heroes from shuffle, then Grapes would become another Angel of the Lord essentially.

That being said, there is one option I have used before. Choose the blocker and choose Prince of Persia (Di) to block.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: COUNTER_SNIPER on January 25, 2011, 02:29:41 PM
Yeah, if you could protect from shuffle, then ANB would have some major issues...  Would be fun to try and pull off (If someone hasn't tried already).

-C_S
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 25, 2011, 02:41:55 PM
I have a good reason.. :(

We don't doubt that, however if there was a way to protect Heroes from shuffle, then Grapes would become another Angel of the Lord essentially.

That being said, there is one option I have used before. Choose the blocker and choose Prince of Persia (Di) to block.
I prefer Wandering Spirit.

There is nothing that protects in battle heroes from shuffle. Trust me. I went through every card (through kings, at least...) looking for one during the building of COMBO COMBO COMBO COMBO CONGO!!!!
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Rawrlolsauce! on January 25, 2011, 02:43:12 PM
Yeah, if you could protect from shuffle, then ANB would have some major issues...  Would be fun to try and pull off

-C_S
^^^^^^This man knows what he is talking about
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 02:53:29 PM
Hmm, if I have Simon the Zealot out (protect deck from opponent's cards), he clearly protects my deck from shuffle, right? So what happens in that situation?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: The Guardian on January 25, 2011, 02:56:51 PM
The deck is not being targeted by Grapes--the cards in battle are. When the Hero is targeted for shuffle, the deck gets shuffled by game rule, not by special ability.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 03:04:24 PM
Really? Even though grapes is my opponent's card, and is directly being affected by it? Don't shuffle abilities specifically target a deck as well?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: The Guardian on January 25, 2011, 03:07:25 PM
Really? Even though grapes is my opponent's card, and is directly being affected by it? Don't shuffle abilities specifically target a deck as well?

In some cases yes (i.e. when a card says 'Shuffle draw pile'), but other times the deck is shuffled by game rule.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: SomeKittens on January 25, 2011, 03:14:07 PM
Are there any cards that protect my deck from game rules?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Rawrlolsauce! on January 25, 2011, 03:15:05 PM
Are there any decks that protect my game rules from cards?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Minister Polarius on January 25, 2011, 03:15:48 PM
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Money.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 03:20:12 PM
Really? I feel like I must disagree, the special ability on grapes says to shuffle into deck. I sort of figured that counted as it being targeted..

Type: Lamb • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: Discard an evil card in battle to shuffle all remaining characters in battle into owners’ decks. If the current rescuer doesn't have the most Redeemed Souls, he may begin a new battle.

Even if that's not the case, if my deck is protected from your cards,  and your card says "put this card in opponent's deck" , wouldn't my deck be protected from YOUR abilities adding cards to my deck? Or does it specifically have to target the deck, even though the deck is being directly affected?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Minister Polarius on January 25, 2011, 03:35:39 PM
Now you've got it.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: COUNTER_SNIPER on January 25, 2011, 05:15:51 PM
Are there any evil characters that are protected from shuffle?  If so... ^_^ BOOYAH!!

-C_S
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 25, 2011, 05:31:41 PM
Not in battle.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 25, 2011, 06:04:39 PM
Quote
Are there any evil characters that are protected from shuffle?  If so... ^_^ BOOYAH!!

Technically no, however any EC that is immune to the hero doing the shuffling would not be shuffled. For example, I was playing a draft and had emperor nero in battle, opponent played new beginning which didn't shuffle nero due to immunity. Other than that I'm pretty sure none are protected from it specifically.

Also, I think I'm still confused on how protect works in this scenario. Could someone explain to me why shuffling my deck with grapes counts as a "game rule" rather than my deck being shuffled by grapes?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Minister Polarius on January 25, 2011, 11:18:40 PM
Grapes does not target any decks. "Shuffle" abilities target the characters that are going to be shuffled, and then by the definition of shuffle, they go into your deck and the deck is shuffled.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 25, 2011, 11:57:11 PM
I can't think of a reason the deck would need to be protected from shuffle. Is there a card that says to shuffle the deck and isn't just a clarifier?
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: COUNTER_SNIPER on January 26, 2011, 12:01:00 AM
Not in battle.

There must be a way... Some day, it will just come to me.

-C_S
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 26, 2011, 12:01:12 AM
It's really not so much about the shuffle, it was the fact that even though it's an indirect effect, I was under the impression that it counted as being done by the opponent's card, which would mean that Simon would protect from it. I'm pretty sure I understand it now though, thanks for the clarification guys. :O
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 26, 2011, 12:32:15 AM
Not in battle.

There must be a way... Some day, it will just come to me.

-C_S
I searched every card for a guy who protected themselves from shuffle. The only solution I could find was to be immune to yourself, but that wouldn't help in the event of grapes. And it doesn't even work anymore.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: COUNTER_SNIPER on January 26, 2011, 12:38:18 AM
Not in battle.

There must be a way... Some day, it will just come to me.

-C_S
I searched every card for a guy who protected themselves from shuffle. The only solution I could find was to be immune to yourself, but that wouldn't help in the event of grapes. And it doesn't even work anymore.

I'm thinking bigger! Or am I thinking Arby's? No, definitely thinking ANB scale...  Yup, you can't be immune/ignore yourself.  And yeah, I'm gonna drop this now.

-C_S
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 26, 2011, 12:42:59 AM
Not in battle.

There must be a way... Some day, it will just come to me.

-C_S
I searched every card for a guy who protected themselves from shuffle. The only solution I could find was to be immune to yourself, but that wouldn't help in the event of grapes. And it doesn't even work anymore.

I'm thinking bigger! Or am I thinking Arby's? No, definitely thinking ANB scale...  Yup, you can't be immune/ignore yourself.  And yeah, I'm gonna drop this now.

-C_S
You can, however, be immune to your own allignment, so you can still do part of COMBO COMBO COMBO COMBO CONGO!!!! for the automatic soul, you just can't do it five times in a row. Just stick Eleazar's Sword on a random green guy instead of on the Philly. ET + Unified Kingdom + Eliashama + Eleazar (or any random green dude) + Eleazar's Sword + Israelite Archer. Place ANB on a converted Philly, band in the Philly, heroes stay (except for the Philly), soul is won.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Perri on January 26, 2011, 12:45:14 AM
Or you could just play a Syrian defense with house of Rimmon. That is one of the better defenses to pair with green prophets.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: SomeKittens on January 26, 2011, 09:13:17 AM
But then one doesn't have any male phillies to be immune to.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 26, 2011, 09:39:23 AM
Or you could just play a Syrian defense with house of Rimmon. That is one of the better defenses to pair with green prophets.
Except that only protects territory.
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: COUNTER_SNIPER on January 26, 2011, 10:59:06 AM
Not in battle.

There must be a way... Some day, it will just come to me.

-C_S
I searched every card for a guy who protected themselves from shuffle. The only solution I could find was to be immune to yourself, but that wouldn't help in the event of grapes. And it doesn't even work anymore.

I'm thinking bigger! Or am I thinking Arby's? No, definitely thinking ANB scale...  Yup, you can't be immune/ignore yourself.  And yeah, I'm gonna drop this now.

-C_S
You can, however, be immune to your own allignment, so you can still do part of COMBO COMBO COMBO COMBO CONGO!!!! for the automatic soul, you just can't do it five times in a row. Just stick Eleazar's Sword on a random green guy instead of on the Philly. ET + Unified Kingdom + Eliashama + Eleazar (or any random green dude) + Eleazar's Sword + Israelite Archer. Place ANB on a converted Philly, band in the Philly, heroes stay (except for the Philly), soul is won.

I like it.  I see you've already beaten me to it, and that it looks a bit difficult to pull off quickly in T1, but I like it.  Nice work.

-C_S
Title: Re: Protection from shuffle for good characters?
Post by: Warrior_Monk on January 26, 2011, 12:27:04 PM
Oh, with Thorns or another Archer to band to Paladin the Fighter

It takes too long in T2 as well. Especially now that you can't do it five times before your opponent has a turn.
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