Author Topic: Weakness... (Read 3056 times)

BubbleBoy · « **on:** June 21, 2009, 09:41:21 PM »

Quote from: REG/Card Index/Weakness

Type: Evil Enh. • Brigade: Brown • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: Place this card in a player's territory. If that player controls a Hero in battle that has decreased toughness, the blocker has initiative to play the first enhancement in battle. • Identifiers: None • Verse: Lamentations 1:6 • Availability: Angel Wars booster packs (Rare)

First of all, I believe (because of the Angel's Sword ruling) that "play first enhancement" now means the same as "play next enhancement," correct? So do I get to use Weakness once per block, or once per entrance of an EC? For example, can I block with an EC, use Weakness to band in another EC, and then use Weakness again on that EC to play another enhancement? I'm going to guess that isn't how it works, but I thought I'd try just in case.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #1 on:** June 21, 2009, 09:46:11 PM »

Special abilities only activate once per turn, unless they specify otherwise. This one does not specify otherwise.

Hanno102 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 21, 2009, 09:50:03 PM »

Its funny, just earlier today I was looking at the card trying to figure out how exactly it worked with the new ruling.

The way I figured it, the ability would effectively read: Place this card in a player's territory, if that player controls a Hero in battle that has decreased toughness, the blocker has initiative to play the next enhancement in battle. Therefore, it would be treated as ongoing ability.

That being so, I can't figure out why you wouldn't get unlimited initiative against that hero, simply because the ability triggers everytime you check for initiative.

I know that can't (or shouldn't) be right, so what am I doing wrong?

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #3 on:** June 21, 2009, 09:53:48 PM »

Since Weakness is a triggered ability, I think it wouldn't activate until after all ECs SAs are complete, so you couldn't play, band, play, band, etc. I think.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #4 on:** June 21, 2009, 09:57:06 PM »

Quote from: RedemptionAggie on June 21, 2009, 09:53:48 PM

Since Weakness is a triggered ability, I think it wouldn't activate until after all ECs SAs are complete, so you couldn't play, band, play, band, etc. I think.

But my question to you is: Is Weakness triggered when you block, or is it triggered when an EC enters battle? I would think it is triggered when you block, in which case you would be correct, but...

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #5 on:** June 21, 2009, 10:04:33 PM »

I still think you can't play, band, play, but it may be band, play, play - not sure. Assuming Hanno's interpretation is correct (I think it is an ongoing SA), the question is almost moot, I think.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #6 on:** June 21, 2009, 10:17:30 PM »

We cannot change the wording of the card just because of a ruling that people don't seem to like. The card says "play first," which is a "play next" ability, which the REG defines as an instant ability, which can only be activated once per turn.

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #7 on:** June 21, 2009, 10:26:38 PM »

Weakness is an ongoing ability, since "If that player controls a Hero in battle that has decreased toughness" is a dynamic effect. The play is instant.

If instant abilities can only be activated once per turn, how does RBD work?

Rain Becomes Dust:

Quote

All cards that an opponent draws because of a special ability used by that opponent are revealed instead. Place all revealed Lost Souls in opponent’s territory. Discard the rest.

The reveal and discard are instant. So RBD only stops one draw card per turn?

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #8 on:** June 21, 2009, 10:39:22 PM »

Fine. They are triggered instant abilities. RBD specifies "all" which is plural. Weakness specifies "the blocker" and "first" which are both singular.

Weakness can only be used once per turn.

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #9 on:** June 21, 2009, 10:45:11 PM »

Probably once per battle (in the case of The Long Day). Still not 100% sure I agree with that statement, though it probably should be the case.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #10 on:** June 21, 2009, 10:52:30 PM »

I can live with "once per Battle Phase" per the REG:

Instant Abilities > Fight Each Other > Default Conditions

• Instant abilities activate only once in the same Battle Phase.

SirNobody · « **Reply #11 on:** June 22, 2009, 12:40:47 PM »

Hey,

The wording on Weakness isn't very clear as to when the ability is triggered and the rule change that made "play first" abilities the same as "play next" abilities didn't help anything. Weakness probably needs play as, something along the lines of "Place this card in a player's territory. When a rescue attempt or battle challenge made by that player is blocked, the blocker may play an enhancement."

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #12 on:** June 22, 2009, 12:52:45 PM »

Quote from: SirNobody on June 22, 2009, 12:40:47 PM

"Place this card in a player's territory. When a rescue attempt or battle challenge made by that player is blocked, the blocker may play an enhancement."

If it was word for word what you said, that would be majorly broken.

TimMierz · « **Reply #13 on:** June 22, 2009, 01:01:43 PM »

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on June 21, 2009, 10:52:30 PM

Instant Abilities > Fight Each Other > Default Conditions

• Instant abilities activate only once in the same Battle Phase.

But using the Rain Becomes Dust example from before, I would think that the instant "reveal and discard" ability happens each time they play a draw ability.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #14 on:** June 22, 2009, 01:04:16 PM »

How about I bring up a more controversial card...

Gifts of the Magi. Draw is an instant ability is it not? Owch.... look out speed decks.

*EDIT* I realize it says "each time that...." but, still, instant abilities only activate once right?

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #15 on:** June 22, 2009, 01:10:09 PM »

I don't understand why you guys are using cards that are in no way related to the card in question. RBD says "all" and Gifts says "each." Weakness says "the" and "first."

Master KChief · « **Reply #16 on:** June 22, 2009, 03:35:30 PM »

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on June 22, 2009, 01:10:09 PM

I don't understand why you guys are using cards that are in no way related to the card in question. RBD says "all" and Gifts says "each." Weakness says "the" and "first."

'first' now equals 'next' as per the ruling.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #17 on:** June 22, 2009, 03:44:24 PM »

...which is still a one-time singular action.....

Master KChief · « **Reply #18 on:** June 22, 2009, 04:13:21 PM »

the way i understand it is it triggers everytime a blocker is presented in battle. if you present another blocker, you may play the 'next' enhancement.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #19 on:** June 22, 2009, 04:40:12 PM »

I guess I missed the ruling that Angel's Sword allows you to play an enhancement after each EC enters the same battle. Here I thought Angel's Sword only let you play one enhancement.

My mistake.

Arch Angel · « **Reply #20 on:** June 22, 2009, 11:19:28 PM »

First may now = next, but next also = an enhancement according to the new rulling (here)

That said, Weakness definitely needs a play as. Something as simple as the intuitive line "May be used once per battle" or some such.

News:

Author Topic: Weakness... (Read 3056 times)

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo