Author Topic: Tournament Deck Building (Read 4434 times)

Chronic Apathy · « **on:** February 18, 2012, 10:57:45 PM »

This is something I've had on my mind for a while, and I'd like to throw it out there and see what people have to say about it. There are currently two rules in place (three decks per player and no editing decks after they've been checked) that benefit players with more money and more cards. While both of these rules are certainly necessary in some form or another, I think that the latter should have a very slight modification to benefit those with less resources; I would like to see an exception allowed to let players add a Haman's Plot if they rip one during regular tournament play, in between rounds. Realistically, anyone could get away with this to begin with, and I think it would lessen the gap between players who can afford to check three identical decks in and the players who can only afford one deck, especially at big tournaments like nationals. I recognize there's a level of fairness there, but like I said, if someone wants to add a Plot to their deck in between rounds, it would extremely hard for them to get caught anyway.

Dario Dante · « **Reply #1 on:** February 18, 2012, 11:05:07 PM »

I would like that since I play with a Plot myself. That's why I always restrict myself to using it only in the Last Round. Like When I was versing you in NY it was 2nd Round, so I prevented myself from using Plot so then maybe I could get more use in the final round.

Jmbeers · « **Reply #2 on:** February 18, 2012, 11:48:26 PM »

I like the sound of that. It's not a huge or difficult rule change but it does raise questions for other game types like booster. Say a player uses a plot is he then allowed to replace the missing card next game to keep a legal deck of 50 cards or should they just keep using 51-56 card decks?

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #3 on:** February 18, 2012, 11:51:14 PM »

Quote from: Jmbeers on February 18, 2012, 11:48:26 PM

I like the sound of that. It's not a huge or difficult rule change but it does raise questions for other game types like booster. Say a player uses a plot is he then allowed to replace the missing card next game to keep a legal deck of 50 cards or should they just keep using 51-56 card decks?

I'd say this would only apply in open deck categories.

everytribe · « **Reply #4 on:** February 18, 2012, 11:55:53 PM »

I would like it to go the other way. I think only one deck should be allowed to be checked in with a Plot in it. The idea of ripping a Plot is so that a person can't use it in future rounds.

TheHobbit13 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 18, 2012, 11:59:44 PM »

I like were you are going but I think a rule like that would actually help the top players more as they use plot the most.

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #6 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:03:49 AM »

That's true Hobbit, I like Bill's idea then.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #7 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:08:04 AM »

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on February 18, 2012, 11:59:44 PM

I like were you are going but I think a rule like that would actually help the top players more as they use plot the most.

I would have used Plot last year, but I didn't have the money to build three identical decks for Plot use. Thus, I stuck with my Phillies and only one deck. I'd be in support of this rule. I don't see how it helps top players, as they're going to Plot anyway.

Jmbeers · « **Reply #8 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:08:31 AM »

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on February 19, 2012, 12:03:49 AM

That's true Hobbit, I like Bill's idea then.

So you went from let's have plot's every round to 1 a tournament... That's quite a change of heart. And it only took 5 posts!!

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #9 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:18:06 AM »

Quote from: Jmbeers on February 19, 2012, 12:08:31 AM

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on February 19, 2012, 12:03:49 AM
That's true Hobbit, I like Bill's idea then.

So you went from let's have plot's every round to 1 a tournament... That's quite a change of heart. And it only took 5 posts!!

It fixes the problem of severe inequality either way.

lp670sv · « **Reply #10 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:24:22 AM »

or you could combine them, you can switch in plots, limit 3 per tourney.

Jmbeers · « **Reply #11 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:29:07 AM »

Pshhhhhh the middle ground is for the week hearted and politicians, (one in the same... I know)

lp670sv · « **Reply #12 on:** February 19, 2012, 12:29:59 AM »

lol politicians compromising, now THAT is good joke

TheHobbit13 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 19, 2012, 10:35:16 AM »

Quote from: SomeKittens on February 19, 2012, 12:08:04 AM

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on February 18, 2012, 11:59:44 PM
I like were you are going but I think a rule like that would actually help the top players more as they use plot the most.
I would have used Plot last year, but I didn't have the money to build three identical decks for Plot use. Thus, I stuck with my Phillies and only one deck. I'd be in support of this rule. I don't see how it helps top players, as they're going to Plot anyway.

I was more referring to newer playes then top players like yourself. I see it helping top players more because now they can rip plots against opponent's they would not normally plot.

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on February 19, 2012, 12:03:49 AM

That's true Hobbit, I like Bill's idea then.

I agree as it effectively evens out part of the playing field and doesn't hurt your wallet. This also goes along well with the intention of the card, as wb said. Although I would modify his rule slightly. You can have multiple decks with plot but can only use plot(s) in one sitting. That way you can check in different decks in case you don't uses it by the time you want to switch. I don't know what we would do about the extra plots, probably just make people take them out of their other decks.

STAMP · « **Reply #14 on:** February 19, 2012, 02:35:36 PM »

Quote from: everytribe on February 18, 2012, 11:55:53 PM

I would like it to go the other way. I think only one deck should be allowed to be checked in with a Plot in it. The idea of ripping a Plot is so that a person can't use it in future rounds.

A very wise man.

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #15 on:** February 19, 2012, 03:55:36 PM »

I think that gets more complicated, Hobbit, which is what we're trying to avoid. I'd just say that in any given category, a player may not check in more than one deck with a Haman's Plot in it.

TheHobbit13 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 19, 2012, 04:27:52 PM »

Fair enough.

cookie monster · « **Reply #17 on:** February 20, 2012, 03:22:58 AM »

I do kind of like the idea of being allowed to switch you plot three times per tourney because I am a poor player and can't afford enough cards to make three identical decks, so I just don't use plot. but if we were allowed three plots per tourney then all players could use plot more then ounce instead of only the players with more money being able to have this opportunity.

We could make it so that you could check in you three plots with you deck to avoid some players using three per deck, instead of three per tourney.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #18 on:** February 21, 2012, 03:35:11 PM »

Quote from: cookie monster on February 20, 2012, 03:22:58 AM

I do kind of like the idea of being allowed to switch you plot three times per tourney because I am a poor player and can't afford enough cards to make three identical decks, so I just don't use plot. but if we were allowed three plots per tourney then all players could use plot more then ounce instead of only the players with more money being able to have this opportunity.

We could make it so that you could check in you three plots with you deck to avoid some players using three per deck, instead of three per tourney.

This is a pretty smart idea. It'd also stop players from rufflng around in their collections, pulling a random card, and sticking it in their deck.

TheHobbit13 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 21, 2012, 03:45:41 PM »

Why are indentical decks an issue? Plot is the issue.

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #20 on:** February 21, 2012, 03:58:01 PM »

One of the benefits to potentially changing the rule to one Plot per tournament would be forcing people to maybe use more expansive standalone (or not standalone at all) in decks.

cookie monster · « **Reply #21 on:** February 29, 2012, 02:49:56 AM »

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on February 21, 2012, 03:58:01 PM

One of the benefits to potentially changing the rule to one Plot per tournament would be forcing people to maybe use more expansive standalone (or not standalone at all) in decks.

What do you mean by "more expensive standalone (or no stand alone at all) in decks."?

SirNobody · « **Reply #22 on:** February 29, 2012, 01:45:47 PM »

Hey,

I'm one of the players that builds three identical decks so that I can tear multiple plots, so my comments might be disregarded as biased, but I'll share them anyway.

If we allowed proxies to be used at tournaments it would benefit players with less resources (especially in Type 2), should we allow that too? No, because if we did, players wouldn't have to buy any cards. One of the reasons that Cactus sanctions tournaments is because it encourages sales. Requiring multiple decks for multiple plots just further encourages sales.

The release of Haman's Gallows and recent influx of counters to CBN discard I think has done a very effective job of leveling the playing field.

For a completely different reason - to prevent players from choosing their deck based on their opponent, which is not allowed but is virtually unenforceable - I'd actually like to see players only allowed to check in one deck at a tournament.

Quote from: SomeKittens on February 19, 2012, 12:08:04 AM

I would have used Plot last year, but I didn't have the money to build three identical decks for Plot use. Thus, I stuck with my Phillies and only one deck. I'd be in support of this rule. I don't see how it helps top players, as they're going to Plot anyway.

Depending on how you build defenses, you don't necessarily need three decks. Two is often enough, and in most tournament (5 or less rounds) is all you're allowed. I've been using plot in all of my tournament decks for 6(?) years now, and I've only torn all of my plots in two or three tournaments.

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on February 18, 2012, 10:57:45 PM

if someone wants to add a Plot to their deck in between rounds, it would extremely hard for them to get caught anyway.

Have you tried? I highly doubt someone could pull it off. When a plot is torn it's noteworthy enough that it gets talked about between rounds. People would catch on if a player that only checked in one deck tore multiple plots in the tournament.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

SomeKittens · « **Reply #23 on:** February 29, 2012, 02:05:56 PM »

Quote from: SirNobody on February 29, 2012, 01:45:47 PM

Quote from: SomeKittens on February 19, 2012, 12:08:04 AM
I would have used Plot last year, but I didn't have the money to build three identical decks for Plot use. Thus, I stuck with my Phillies and only one deck. I'd be in support of this rule. I don't see how it helps top players, as they're going to Plot anyway.

Depending on how you build defenses, you don't necessarily need three decks. Two is often enough, and in most tournament (5 or less rounds) is all you're allowed. I've been using plot in all of my tournament decks for 6(?) years now, and I've only torn all of my plots in two or three tournaments.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

That would be a 10 round nats. I didn't have the dom loadout for 2 decks, much less three.

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #24 on:** February 29, 2012, 02:11:37 PM »

Quote from: cookie monster on February 29, 2012, 02:49:56 AM

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on February 21, 2012, 03:58:01 PM
One of the benefits to potentially changing the rule to one Plot per tournament would be forcing people to maybe use more expansive standalone (or not standalone at all) in decks.

What do you mean by "more expensive standalone (or no stand alone at all) in decks."?

Expansive, not expensive.

Tim, using proxies and allowing the exchange of Plots are entirely different, and frankly, I doubt this rule would hurt sales. If someone decides they need multiple Plots for their Nats deck, they aren't going to go open a bunch of Patriarch packs, they're going to trade for individual Plots.

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Author Topic: Tournament Deck Building (Read 4434 times)

Chronic Apathy

Chronic Apathy

TheHobbit13

Chronic Apathy

Chronic Apathy

TheHobbit13

Chronic Apathy

TheHobbit13

TheHobbit13

Chronic Apathy

Chronic Apathy