Author Topic: The Gates of Hell  (Read 4431 times)

Offline Smokey

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The Gates of Hell
« on: August 10, 2009, 05:29:08 PM »
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If I have The Gates of Hell active, and I make a RA, can I discard it to add my demon to my opponents side of the battle?
I'm thinking it doesn't work, I just want a second opinion.

The Gates of Hell
 
Type: Fortress • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: At any time, you may discard the bottom card of deck. If it is an orange demon or a Lost Soul, place it in your territory instead. You may discard this card to add your demon to the battle. • Attributes: Plays to set-aside area • Identifiers: None • Verse: Matthew 16:18 • Availability: Thesaurus ex Preteritus booster packs

Offline Cameron the Conqueror

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2009, 05:33:06 PM »
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I don't see why not.  Cool idea.


Offline Alex_Olijar

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2009, 05:37:56 PM »
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I suggest using it in MN.

Offline lightningninja

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2009, 05:45:50 PM »
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NEVER!
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Offline Smokey

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2009, 05:47:31 PM »
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Anyone have any proof either way about this or are we just going off the wording of it?

Offline Arch Angel

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2009, 05:51:35 PM »
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I think it works, because we already know that Add to Battle is the same as Banding. We also already know that your ECs can be banded into battle against you. The card doesn't say that it has to be while your Opponent's hero is in battle or anything, so I can't think of a reason why it SHOULDN'T work at this point.

Offline Sean

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2009, 05:54:02 PM »
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You would have to add it to the opposing side of the battle.  I don't think it is a legal play because your opponent is the one who has choice of which Evil Character to add to the battle, not you.
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Offline lightningninja

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2009, 05:54:30 PM »
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Actually, I'm pretty sure this works.
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Offline Gabe

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2009, 05:57:23 PM »
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The Gates of Hell allows you to add a character to your side of the battle.  If you're making a RA or BC with a Hero in battle you cannot add an evil Character to battle to fight with them.  Nowhere does TGoH say anything about choosing the blocker or adding a character to the opponent's side of the battle.
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Offline lightningninja

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2009, 05:59:59 PM »
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It also doesn't specify YOUR side of the battle... I'd like to get an official word on this, cause a few other strategies of mine rest on this.
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Offline Minister Polarius

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2009, 06:04:12 PM »
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I agree, it's complete conjecture at this point to say that Gates of Hell adds a demon to your side of the battle. That's simply not on the card.
I am not talking about T2 unless I am explicitly talking about T2. Also Mayhem is fine now somehow!

The Schaef

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2009, 06:11:05 PM »
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I'm not aware of a situation where you band to an opponent's side of the battle without it actually saying "opponent's whatever bands to battle"

Offline Minister Polarius

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2009, 06:14:11 PM »
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I am, Gates of Hell. It's a new card, and all other cards with similar language specifically disallow doing what we are suggesting while this one does not.
I am not talking about T2 unless I am explicitly talking about T2. Also Mayhem is fine now somehow!

Offline lightningninja

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2009, 06:14:55 PM »
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Ezekiel's Stick: "add one hero to battle." It doesn't specify your opponent's character, but you can band to your opponent's heroes nontheless.
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Offline RedemptionAggie

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2009, 08:26:06 PM »
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The Silver Trumpets:
When your Priest has initiative during a rescue attempt, you may band a human O.T. Hero from your territory into battle or interrupt the battle and return your Heroes in battle to hand. May be used twice.

I'm pretty sure this was discussed with regards to The Silver Trumpets and the answer was you couldn't band an OT Hero to your opponent's side of battle if your evil Priest had initiative.

Offline Cameron the Conqueror

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2009, 08:55:46 PM »
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If that was the case, a Errata would be necessary because it seems obvious IMO that it can with the printed words.

Offline frisian9

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2009, 08:57:41 PM »
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"Add to battle" is a form of banding. It is not associated with choose the blocker.

Looking at the banding section of the REG, is see it does not explicitly state the default condition for which characters (good or evil) you may band. It should have a default condition that requires banding to apply to characters being added to your side of the battle (unless stated otherwise - see "Siege"). We have understood this to be true, but it isn't in print.

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Offline Smokey

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2009, 09:57:42 PM »
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The Silver Trumpets:
When your Priest has initiative during a rescue attempt, you may band a human O.T. Hero from your territory into battle or interrupt the battle and return your Heroes in battle to hand. May be used twice.

I'm pretty sure this was discussed with regards to The Silver Trumpets and the answer was you couldn't band an OT Hero to your opponent's side of battle if your evil Priest had initiative.

The bolded txt tells all.

"Add to battle" is a form of banding. It is not associated with choose the blocker.

Looking at the banding section of the REG, is see it does not explicitly state the default condition for which characters (good or evil) you may band. It should have a default condition that requires banding to apply to characters being added to your side of the battle (unless stated otherwise - see "Siege"). We have understood this to be true, but it isn't in print.

Mike

Because it isn't in print does that mean it's legal at the moment?  :P

Offline frisian9

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2009, 11:04:49 PM »
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I would be very surprised if it isn't mentioned somewhere in the rulebook. You may look it up. I know you can't band your characters to your opponent's side. Think about it - you do it and likely never lose initiative. Who would play with those rules?

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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2009, 11:19:19 PM »
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Instant Abilities > Band > How to Use

Players may band to any opponent’s character(s) unless the opponent’s cards are protected from being brought into battle (e.g., Wall of Protection).  The player bringing in the additional characters is referred to as the holder and retains control until the end of battle.  

This quote would seem to indicate that you cannot band onto the opposition's side, since you cannot control that character.
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Lamborghini_diablo

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2009, 11:23:25 PM »
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I do not feel this works either. Im all for sweet combos but...

When a player uses a banding ability, they are adding characters to THEIR side. If they add characters to the opponents side, then it is a Choose the Blocker ability.

It really isnt that confusing. Band = add to your side. CTB/R = add to opponents side.

Offline NWJosh

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2009, 11:58:14 PM »
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I honestly could see arguments for both sides but I would agree with the idea that you can not add a demon to your opponents blocking.  If you could I would say that your opponent can still choose to block with a character of their choice but once again I don't see this being in agreement with the basic rules of the game.

Plus how unfair would it be if your had Prince of this World put in the battle and you had a single hero for the start of the battle.  Then as you were about to lose inititive you pulled another demon out like Thief which would give you even more initive, and so on and so on. You could sit and play enhancements for a while as long as you kept adding demons.  Then finish it of with something like David's Music to put them all back......Hmmmm maybe I want to change my thoughts on the ruling LOL ;)
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Offline redemption99

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2009, 12:05:08 AM »
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so is the darkness the one exception because it says , 'oppenent may band into battle'?
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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #23 on: August 11, 2009, 12:12:06 AM »
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I agree with everyone else that you can't get a "choose the blocker" ability without using a card that is a "choose the blocker" card.

Like anyone would try to do that.  Like with "Doubt".  Like trying to break TEAMS.  Like you know who you are :)

Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: The Gates of Hell
« Reply #24 on: August 11, 2009, 12:40:40 AM »
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so is the darkness the one exception because it says , 'oppenent may band into battle'?

More specifically it says "Blocking player may add it to battle," but you are correct that is why it is an exception.
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