Author Topic: special initive when does it end (Read 7138 times)

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #25 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:33:43 PM »

Two Bears isn't completed until one or the other happens. I'm pretty sure on one of the white cards it says dominants can't be played while special abilities haven't completed (it might be Priest white cards?), but I'm too lazy to go check.

Korunks · « **Reply #26 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:36:39 PM »

And since when has initiative to negate become part of the special ability of a card?

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #27 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:39:30 PM »

What do you mean by that? Two Bears is still trying to complete its shuffle ability when I have the special initiative. You can't play a dominant until Two Bears is no longer doing that.

Atleast this is my take on it....

Korunks · « **Reply #28 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:41:33 PM »

And I have always heard that an enhancement is completly done before you can negate it. Maybe we need an elder to rule on this.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #29 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:43:09 PM »

Exactly. Special Initiative by nature, happens BEFORE a card finishes its ability.

Otherwise, how can I stop a remove from game card? If I don't interrupt it BEFORE it finishes, my character is no longer a part of the game, and I can't play an interrupt on it.

Korunks · « **Reply #30 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:46:53 PM »

But like I keep saying, that is not listed in the rules. Is it some reasoning we came up with to explain how the game works, or is it the actual letter of the law? Again where is the rule for that statement. other than thats how we have always understood it.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #31 on:** March 24, 2011, 01:53:41 PM »

I'm thinking about how it would play out in a 1 vs 1 situation. If you use an ability to remove my character from battle in any way, I must stop it BEFORE I leave battle, or else I have no EC's left to play my cards on. I can't have my EC shuffled, and THEN negate it mysteriously from the draw pile, and get a free shuffle as well.

I mean, that makes sense doesn't it?

Korunks · « **Reply #32 on:** March 24, 2011, 02:20:58 PM »

I agree it makes sense, but its not in the REG, rule book or a ruling post. So I guess I just want there to be a ruling that says special intiative is tied to the ability of the cards causing that side to lose the battle. I think that would adequately address the issue.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #33 on:** March 24, 2011, 02:29:47 PM »

The more I look into it, the more I realize the definition of interrupt needs to be modified.

Interrupt
Interrupt is used to temporarily stop a previously completed card’s special ability until the special ability on the interrupt card is completed.

Under that definition, I would say all battle winning cards cannot be interrupted, because once the ability completes, your character is no longer in battle to play cards on.

So... either "Special Initiative" needs to get a definition, or interrupt needs to be changed to say:
Interrupt is used to temporarily stop the special ability on a card that is currently activating or has previously completed until the special ability on the interrupt card is completed.

Soundman2 · « **Reply #34 on:** March 25, 2011, 02:50:15 AM »

am I interpreting this right? Guy bands 2 ec into battle opponent plays 2 bears shuffles one EC gives guy a chances to interrupt guy does not opponent plays AotL Guy now whats to interrupt 2 bears? right?

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #35 on:** March 25, 2011, 02:53:22 AM »

That's the situation, yes. It seems to me like opinion is leaning toward still being able to interrupt, which is madness.

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #36 on:** March 25, 2011, 10:46:34 AM »

Quote from: Korunks on March 24, 2011, 11:00:00 AM

So this can be considered official?

Since Schaef made the ruling (long before I became an elder) I would like to hear his input on this. But until then, it is the standing ruling.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #37 on:** March 25, 2011, 10:48:26 AM »

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #38 on:** March 25, 2011, 11:36:04 AM »

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #39 on:** March 25, 2011, 12:01:36 PM »

Professoralstad · « **Reply #40 on:** March 25, 2011, 12:22:16 PM »

Sorry, I just had to.

I agree that the current ruling is as Schaef said...I don't necessarily agree with the spirit of the ruling, because I am of the opinion that if you want to play an ItB card to stop something like a shuffle from happening, you should do so BEFORE you actually shuffle. I think that nothing should be able to happen between the removal of an EC from battle and the chance to interrupt in case of initiative transferring (including dominants--for example, I don't believe you can play Mayhem after a battle winner to shuffle any interrupts they may have, etc.) and I think that once the act physically happens (a character is actually shuffled into deck, physically placed into a land of bondage after capture, etc.) that it is too late to play an ItB card.

Red Dragon Thorn · « **Reply #41 on:** March 25, 2011, 01:22:44 PM »

All these pictures of dogs are confusing me... Which way is this being ruled?

SomeKittens · « **Reply #42 on:** March 25, 2011, 01:25:29 PM »

Quote from: Red Dragon Thorn on March 25, 2011, 01:22:44 PM

All these pictures of dogs are confusing me... Which way is this being ruled?

Looks like this ruling....

...is for the dogs.

Soundman2 · « **Reply #43 on:** March 25, 2011, 04:22:43 PM »

Quote from: Minister Polarius on March 25, 2011, 02:53:22 AM

That's the situation, yes. It seems to me like opinion is leaning toward still being able to interrupt, which is madness.

it is madness then. it should have been done before AotL not after.

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #44 on:** March 25, 2011, 04:32:52 PM »

A simple way to do it is say "Are you going to interrupt that?" And if they say no, then play Angel of the Lord. If they say maybe, rage quit...

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #45 on:** March 25, 2011, 07:36:20 PM »

ok so reverse question and this did happen to me in a game the other night.

I attack with claudia banded to Matthew. Opponent blocks with Herod the Great sending Matthew back to territory then CM my Claudia. I have initiative to interrupt with a purple card?

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #46 on:** March 25, 2011, 08:46:33 PM »

Yes, unless you put your Matthew back into your territory and/or waited before trying to interrupt. Your opponent can't slapjack, but you can't dom scout either.

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #47 on:** March 26, 2011, 12:20:20 AM »

So how is my example different from the below example? If I place Matthew back in territory, then they CM Claudia- it seems compared to what ive seen i can still play an interrupt in purple...

Quote from: Prof Underwood on October 30, 2008, 05:16:51 PM
It sounds like you are saying that:
if a 8/8 GC makes a RA and is blocked by 2 5/5 ECs banded together, and
if the GC plays a GE that discards 1 of the 2 ECs, then initiative passes to the defender, but
if the attacker plays AotL on the 2nd EC, then there would be noone left in battle to negate the discard, but
the defender can still play the negate on the first EC that was discarded.

Is that right?
Quote from: The Schaef on October 30, 2008, 05:28:21 PM
If the player had an opportunity to interrupt before AotL was played, he still has an opportunity after.
If the player did not have an opportunity before AotL was played, he does not have an opportunity after.
So in this case, the passing of initiative allows you to play a negate on the first EC, whether AotL is played or not.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #48 on:** March 26, 2011, 12:29:53 AM »

I really think it should come down to "Did you complete the action on the enhancement, or did you choose to interrupt it immediately?"

If you willingly remove one character from battle, then you should NOT be allowed to play any more cards on them. Period. How can I play an enhancement on a character that is no longer in play?

Gabe · « **Reply #49 on:** March 26, 2011, 12:48:41 AM »

It's simple. If you're going to interrupt/negate the removal when you have special initiative, then don't remove your character, instead play your interrupt/negate. Once you've chosen to complete the action by removing your character you've passed the special initiative and has no basis for complaining when a Dominant is played.

News:

Author Topic: special initive when does it end (Read 7138 times)

Rawrlolsauce!

Rawrlolsauce!

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo

Rawrlolsauce!

Warrior_Monk

Lamborghini_diablo