Author Topic: Samaritan Water Jar - Broken in Type 2? (Read 7915 times)

Gohanick · « **on:** August 03, 2009, 01:59:33 PM »

CARD NAME: Samaritan Water Jar [New]
CARD TYPE: Artifact
CLASS:
IDENTIFIERS:
STATS:
BRIGADE COLOR:
Original SPECIAL ABILITY: Discard this card to reveal the top 3 cards of an opponent's deck (or 9 if a Samaritan Hero is in play) and set them aside. Put Lost Souls in play instead. When that deck has no cards, return those cards from set-aside to deck.
SCRIPTURE: The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men, Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ? John 4:28-29

Are these cards set aside face up? I don't know why they would be set aside face down if it doesnt specify.
If they are set aside face up, that player won't be able to play any duplicate permanents (characters, forts etc) for as long as they are set aside correct?

Sean · « **Reply #1 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:01:11 PM »

They wouldn't be able to play them face up or face down so either way they can't play duplicates.

Lawfuldog · « **Reply #2 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:05:17 PM »

WOAH!

That never even remotely crossed my mind. I was just playing it as 9 cards they couldn't use until they decked out. Awesome!!! Thanks.

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #3 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:05:33 PM »

I think Archick is onto something. It makes SWJ a massive deck discard.

Sean · « **Reply #4 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:11:55 PM »

I knew SWJ was OP when Schaef posted it in his spoiler thread. I hadn't thought about duplicates yet though.

Hedgehogman · « **Reply #5 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:17:11 PM »

Never thought about this card in Type 2.

I forsee this becoming the next big staple card that everyone hates with a vengeance.

TechnoEthicist · « **Reply #6 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:18:39 PM »

Maybe now the Luke tin can win in booster draft! HA that was a good laugh...

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #7 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:22:03 PM »

Dude! Whoah! Set aside a total of 27 cards that your opponent can't use duplicates of until he decks out?! ...IN TYPE 2?!!!

...Awesome.

Gohanick · « **Reply #8 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:28:05 PM »

Conversely, what happens if SWJ sets aside something that he already has in play?

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #9 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:30:03 PM »

He could discard the card that was set aside, right?

Hanno102 · « **Reply #10 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:39:18 PM »

Fortunately for all us T2 players, the duplicates rule when referring to set-asides ONLY applies to characters - not artifacts, forts, or any other unique card.

No player may control duplicates of a unique character or cause them to fight each other. This includes unique characters in play, in battle, in a side battle, face down, or in a set-aside area. Character cards with the same card title and the same art or with the same title and the same brigade are considered duplicates for deck building purposes. A player may have only control one of these at any time. The only exception to this rule is non-unique characters with different card art.

Some character cards have different card titles, but are the same character. A player may have only one of these in your territory, in battle, in a side battle, face down, or set-aside at a time.

And when referring to other unique cards:

All Artifact, Covenant, Curse, and Fortress cards are considered unique. A player may control only one of these at any time.

I would argue that when these cards are set-aside the player is not controlling them, and therefore do not apply toward the uniqueness rule. If this is wrong, then yes SWJ is rather broken.l

redemption99 · « **Reply #11 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:41:06 PM »

Even though the cards are set-aside I believe you would still be controlling them.

Korunks · « **Reply #12 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:43:01 PM »

Quote

Even though the cards are set-aside I believe you would still be controlling them.

How? I have no control over them until I deck-out.

redemption99 · « **Reply #13 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:47:50 PM »

It's how the rulebook/REG defines 'controlling'. :/

sk · « **Reply #14 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:48:27 PM »

r99 is correct, you still "control" the cards in set aside.

Hanno102 · « **Reply #15 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:50:47 PM »

Quote from: redemption99 on August 03, 2009, 02:41:06 PM

Even though the cards are set-aside I believe you would still be controlling them.

So if someone hits my Gates of Hell, or Kerith ravine (or any other fortress that plays to the set-aside) with Samaritan Water Jar and because I'm still 'controlling' them, they become active and I can use them?

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #16 on:** August 03, 2009, 02:53:14 PM »

Even though they go to the set aside area when played, they must be put in play to activate, so I would say no.

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #17 on:** August 03, 2009, 03:57:18 PM »

I would disagree.

happyjosiah · « **Reply #18 on:** August 03, 2009, 04:09:43 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on August 03, 2009, 02:53:14 PM

Even though they go to the set aside area when played, they must be put in play to activate, so I would say no.

I agree. If your hero gets set aside by something like moses kills egyptian, you can't play set asides on it even though it is in the set aside area. Same idea.

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #19 on:** August 03, 2009, 04:12:20 PM »

Well, you can't play set-aside cards on cards already set aside. If it's ruled the other way than ok, but I don't see why a card that works in set aside could go to set-aside and not work.

crustpope · « **Reply #20 on:** August 03, 2009, 04:25:20 PM »

Quote from: Gohanick on August 03, 2009, 01:59:33 PM

CARD NAME: Samaritan Water Jar [New]
CARD TYPE: Artifact
CLASS:
IDENTIFIERS:
STATS:
BRIGADE COLOR:
Original SPECIAL ABILITY: Discard this card to reveal the top 3 cards of an opponent's deck (or 9 if a Samaritan Hero is in play) and set them aside. Put Lost Souls in play instead. When that deck has no cards, return those cards from set-aside to deck.
SCRIPTURE: The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men, Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ? John 4:28-29

Are these cards set aside face up? I don't know why they would be set aside face down if it doesnt specify.
If they are set aside face up, that player won't be able to play any duplicate permanents (characters, forts etc) for as long as they are set aside correct?

Well every other "reveal" ability places things face down but it is usually at the bottom of the Deck. I think this is one of those things that they will make a ruling on based on how bad it gets. First of all you can only have 3 copies max of SWJ so its not like it is going to hit you all at once. Second There are plenty of card that an undo this such as ANB. Third it is only 27 cards which is about 1/4 of a deck in type 2. I would rather have this than have my entire deck d/c which is what I have had to deal with in the past year. in fact, from my perspective, this card is a blessing compared to that.

I dont think it is broken at all, Just a pain.

happyjosiah · « **Reply #21 on:** August 03, 2009, 04:32:06 PM »

Not to mention on average about four of those 27 will be lost souls (so it's more like 23 set aside).

Gohanick · « **Reply #22 on:** August 03, 2009, 04:33:01 PM »

Yeah but in type 2... about 1/4 of your deck is going to be repeated in the other 3/4ths

happyjosiah · « **Reply #23 on:** August 03, 2009, 04:33:27 PM »

Only matters for uniques though.

lightningninja · « **Reply #24 on:** August 03, 2009, 05:43:04 PM »

HAHAHA. SK, if you want to beat Kurt you can borrow my Water Jar. For now, I'll just be using this card in type I.

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Author Topic: Samaritan Water Jar - Broken in Type 2? (Read 7915 times)