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Author Topic: The "color" of multi-colored cards.  (Read 3133 times)

Offline lightningninja

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #25 on: August 08, 2009, 03:54:14 PM »
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I don't think that covenats don't have brigades... same with curses? Cause I always play job overcomes and count fortresses.
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Offline Gabe

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #26 on: August 08, 2009, 03:56:47 PM »
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Quote from: frisian9 on August 08, 2009, 03:49:40 PM
A covenant card has brigade color when used as a covenant (face value) and as an enhancement, but has no brigade when in use as an artifact. (rulebook glossary)

I believe the bolded part is not true unless it's a recent change.  It directly contradicts rulings given by Schaef, Bryon and others.

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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #27 on: August 08, 2009, 04:01:53 PM »
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Quote from: Master KChief on August 08, 2009, 03:45:49 PM
the alternate option is also a cost. costs must be paid using the holders own resources. you cannot discard another players ec to satisfy that cost.

Does the REG or rulebook say that anywhere? I looked, but I found nothing. As much as this seems logical, it is not a Redemption rule. I have to wonder if any of these cost cards don't specify where the card must come from.
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Offline frisian9

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #28 on: August 08, 2009, 04:04:12 PM »
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I was not able to find a statement about brigade when a covenant (or curse) is being used as an artifact. I do not disagree that it may have been ruled previously - however I have not found it. I would be grateful for help if this is true. I do believe it would be easier to understand if covenants or curses had brigade at all times.

Mike
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Offline happyjosiah

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2009, 04:05:17 PM »
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Sorry for the confusion. I was indeed basing it on RTS.
It seems the only thing left to resolve here is on the color of a covenant when in use as an artifact. There seems to be some conflict.
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Offline sk

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #30 on: August 08, 2009, 04:07:34 PM »
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It has been long ruled that Curses have brigades when used as artifacts.

Thread 1 (Gabe, Mike)
Thread 2 (Gabe)
Thread 3 (Schaef, TimMierz)
Thread 4 (Bryon, Gabe, TimMierz, and others agree curses have brigades)
« Last Edit: August 08, 2009, 04:19:21 PM by sk »
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #31 on: August 08, 2009, 04:09:03 PM »
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The glossary says this under Covenant:

If you want to use it as an artifact, disregard the Bible picture and play the card as you would any other artifact.

If you are "disregarding" the Bible picture, then wouldn't the brigade color also be disregarded? I see this as a "regardless" situation.  ;D
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Offline Gabe

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #32 on: August 08, 2009, 04:29:56 PM »
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Quote from: frisian9 on August 08, 2009, 04:04:12 PM
I was not able to find a statement about brigade when a covenant (or curse) is being used as an artifact. I do not disagree that it may have been ruled previously - however I have not found it. I would be grateful for help if this is true. I do believe it would be easier to understand if covenants or curses had brigade at all times.

Mike

Here's a thread where both Bryon and Schaef state the a Covenant/Curse used as an Artifact keeps it's brigade.

http://www.cactusgamedesign.com/message_boards/index.php?topic=15433.0
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Offline frisian9

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #33 on: August 08, 2009, 04:33:28 PM »
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I based my statement on the rulebook glossary entry that YMT quotes. Thread 1, 2 and 3 don't really help. Thread 4 is a good discussion relevant to the point of brigade WHILE a covenant or curse is active as an artifact. It still has brigade, just as characters captured have brigade. I capitulate.

*edit* Thanks for the additional thread Gabe.

Mike
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Offline lightningninja

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #34 on: August 08, 2009, 04:34:44 PM »
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That's what I thought... thanks Gabe! ;D
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Offline Gabe

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2009, 04:46:03 PM »
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Quote from: frisian9 on August 08, 2009, 04:33:28 PM
...just as characters captured have brigade.

I agree that captured characters should have a brigade but previous rulings have said that they don't.  There was a discussion about that here where Bryon seemed to agree that it should be changed.  Are you saying this change is official now?
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Offline frisian9

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2009, 04:55:51 PM »
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Interesting. I see similarities in treating covenants as artifacts versus characters as lost souls. They are "treated" as something else. It appears we need something official. I'll get back to you.

Mike
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2009, 05:06:50 PM »
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Ooo! Ooo! Mr. Kotter!

If this is open for discussion, then I vote that rulings would be easier if Captured Heroes were simply Lost Souls with no brigades or identifiers, and covenants/curses that are activated as artifacts are simply artifacts with no brigades.
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Offline Arch Angel

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #38 on: August 08, 2009, 05:17:02 PM »
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Quote from: YourMathTeacher on August 08, 2009, 04:01:53 PM
Quote from: Master KChief on August 08, 2009, 03:45:49 PM
the alternate option is also a cost. costs must be paid using the holders own resources. you cannot discard another players ec to satisfy that cost.

Does the REG or rulebook say that anywhere? I looked, but I found nothing. As much as this seems logical, it is not a Redemption rule. I have to wonder if any of these cost cards don't specify where the card must come from.
Trumpet Blast, for one, is a Cost/Benefit card that you can discard your opponent's cards with.
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Offline happyjosiah

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #39 on: August 08, 2009, 06:41:39 PM »
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Quote from: YourMathTeacher on August 08, 2009, 05:06:50 PM
Ooo! Ooo! Mr. Kotter!

If this is open for discussion, then I vote that rulings would be easier if Captured Heroes were simply Lost Souls with no brigades or identifiers, and covenants/curses that are activated as artifacts are simply artifacts with no brigades.
Would be nice. However, a lot of heroes do things to captured heros or some heros have abilities that work when they are captured, etc. You couldn't just ignore all of that.
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: The "color" of multi-colored cards.
« Reply #40 on: August 08, 2009, 08:47:55 PM »
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I could.  ;)
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