Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Only when your opponent draws cards outside of draw phase.  Or until he can discard Abom.  Not that big a deal, really.

Kevin Shride

No, it's not a dynamic ability. "When a Hero is in battle" is just a requirement for when you can use the one-time ability. Writ is neither ongoing nor triggered.

Writ is not a triggered ability.  It is an "at any time" ability (much like a dominant), with a restriction on who it can target (a hero in battle).

Abom is a triggered ability, so it MUST happen first.  However, regardless of the fact that UW is discarded, it was not negated, so its effect lasts through the phase.  Currently, UW is a capture ability that then discards itself.  It does not need to discard itself as part of the cost of the capture.

So, Abom discards UW first, but then you can still capture the hero.  Unless there is errata on UW that reads "Discard this to capture..."

Writ is not a triggered ability.  It is an "at any time" ability (much like a dominant), with a restriction on who it can target (a hero in battle).

Abom is a triggered ability, so it MUST happen first.  However, regardless of the fact that UW is discarded, it was not negated, so its effect lasts through the phase.  Currently, UW is a capture ability that then discards itself.  It does not need to discard itself as part of the cost of the capture.

So, Abom discards UW first, but then you can still capture the hero.  Unless there is errata on UW that reads "Discard this to capture..."

I agree with Bryon completely on this one.

Mike

Hey,

Unholy Writ has an ongoing ability.  If it were not ongoing it would have to be instantaneous, which means it would have to perform it's capture upon activation, which would make the card almost entirely useless since artifacts are very rarely activated when Heroes are in battle.  Unholy Writ is a triggered ability and all triggered abilities are ongoing (I'll come back to this later).

Normal triggered abilities are triggered by events.  Normal triggered abilities are carried out immediately following the event that triggered them.  There is a small set of triggered abilities that are triggered by states(i.e. "while blocking with a Herod") rather than by events.  In these cases, the trigger itself (the state) is not adequate to identify the exact moment when the triggered ability is carried out (because the state lasts for a certain length of time and the ability could be triggered at any moment while the state lasts).   So we allow the player to decide at exactly which moment (while the state is satisfied) these abilities will be carried out.  Effectively the player's will becomes the trigger for the ability.  We call these abilities "manually triggered abilities."  Because it is the player's action (or declaration) that activates the ability we give them the same priority as playing a card (to be exact we give it the same priority as playing a dominant) rather than the same priority as other triggers.

To review breifly priorities of carrying things out: Activating an ability takes priority over carrying out a triggered effect which takes priority over playing a card.

Unholy Writ is the quintessential manually triggered ability (it's actually the first card we ever identified as a manually triggered ability).  This means it is a triggered ability (as referenced above) but it has the priority of playing a dominant.  Abom is an optionally triggered ability (I get to choose if I trigger it vs I get to choose when I trigger a manually triggered ability) which has the priority of carrying out a triggered effect.

So based on the priority of carrying things out mentioned above, Abom takes priority over Unholy Writ.

And since Unholy Writ is ongoing, since Abom doesn't negate it, and since it doesn't have to be in play to be triggered, it can still be used after it is discarded until the end of the phase in which it is discarded.

Which means I agree with Bryon's rulings.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

I was wondering when somebody was going to bring that up - I believe that since becuse Writ says "Capture a hero" it can only be used once, and then its ability is fulfilled.

so, if unholy writ is an ongoing ability that can still be used once discarded, what is stopping a player from using the ability over and over and over during the battle phase?

Always trying to break a card aren't we... 

The language on Unholy Writ requires you to choose a target, that target being a human Hero in battle.  You don't get to choose a new target.  You choose the target once.  That's it.

Bingo-bango, UW needs play-as to "Discard to..."

either one would sit fine with me. another poorly worded card, as usual...

it is not a 'cost: effect' card so there is no 'fulfilling'. as worded, you can spam it during the battle phase.

No need to errata a card that everyone knows how to play.

You mean no need to errata a card that most people won't figure out how to use correctly as worded

it is not a 'cost: effect' card so there is no 'fulfilling'. as worded, you can spam it during the battle phase.

with MKC's assessment of the ability.  As worded, I would rule it allows to super spamming for that phase.  Why do we need to change it however?  If you figure out a way to discard Unholy Writ in the battle phase without negating it, I say you should be able to mass capture everyone in battle.

That I can understand, but the idea that I can manually trigger it after it has been discarded makes no sense to me. However, as Crustpope implied, I am not too bright for not understanding this.

Hey,

if this is true, then i suppose we cant spam captures on high places, even though its worded pretty much the same way.

Unholy Writ allows you to capture "a human hero" - singular.
High Places allows you to play "evil enhancements" - plural.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly