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Author Topic: PSA: Face-down artifacts are in play -- Rule announcement on Split Altar  (Read 1982 times)

Offline Minister Polarius

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PSA: Face-down artifacts are in play -- Rule announcement on Split Altar
« on: June 30, 2017, 11:40:48 AM »
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In a game the other night I ran into a pretty big-name elder not knowing that face-down artifacts count for Outsiders. There are some big tournaments going on so I just wanted to make sure everyone knows.



Modified this post to include Split Altar in the subject line.

~The Guardian
« Last Edit: July 03, 2017, 01:46:34 AM by The Guardian »
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2017, 11:47:36 AM »
+1
To clarify, I knew they were in territory (i.e. they could be hit by Abom or Priests of Zeus), but I was unaware that face down cards were no longer considered "out of play." Apparently that changed in 2013 during a period that I was not very active. Until Outsiders, there weren't any cards where it really mattered so that minor change went unnoticed by myself.  Unfortunately, I have not yet memorized the REG. 8)
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Fortress Alstad
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Have you looked it up in ORCID?

Offline Minister Polarius

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2017, 11:51:04 AM »
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Hey, I didn't name you for a reason! The only reason I even realized it was because face-down arts were in the news lately due to the 3 Woes thread.
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2017, 12:00:51 PM »
+2
I am completely fine with admitting I was unaware of something, no worries.  ;)

Although it was frustrating in the moment to learn something changed over 4 years ago, I'd rather it be in a pick up game than a major tournament game.  :o
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Fortress Alstad
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Offline Red

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2017, 12:11:12 PM »
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I also missed this evidently. And I was active in 2013!
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Offline sepjazzwarrior

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2017, 01:17:54 PM »
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this is also news to me, so with priest of zeus does he get to look at the face down arts before he discards or he just pick one at random?
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2017, 01:31:26 PM »
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You would get to pick a random one I believe since the only "known" attribute of a face down card is the card type.
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Fortress Alstad
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Offline Bobbert

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2017, 01:44:33 PM »
+2
...does this mean that Split Altar works as intended?  :o
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Offline soul seeker

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2017, 01:57:18 PM »
+2
Quote from: Thomas Hunter on June 30, 2017, 01:44:33 PM
...does this mean that Split Altar works as intended?  :o

Yes*




* Don't believe me...I'm just answering the way I want to hear it ruled.   :angel:
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Offline Minister Polarius

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #9 on: June 30, 2017, 02:06:56 PM »
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Sure enough seems to.
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2017, 02:11:55 PM »
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Quote from: Thomas Hunter on June 30, 2017, 01:44:33 PM
...does this mean that Split Altar works as intended?  :o

Hold that thought...
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Fortress Alstad
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2017, 02:21:09 PM »
+2
I'll be offline for a bit, but this is under further review.  :)
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Fortress Alstad
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Offline Red

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #12 on: July 02, 2017, 10:04:03 AM »
+1
Quote from: The Guardian on June 30, 2017, 02:11:55 PM
Quote from: Thomas Hunter on June 30, 2017, 01:44:33 PM
...does this mean that Split Altar works as intended?  :o

Hold that thought...
The REG entry would seem to support that based on several REP's review at EC Regs.
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Offline jbeers285

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2017, 03:53:20 PM »
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Any official word?
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #14 on: July 02, 2017, 04:07:24 PM »
+2
I believe we'll have an answer announced today...just need to double check how many copies of Split Altar I have... ::)


 ;)
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Fortress Alstad
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2017, 01:44:57 AM »
+5
After an extensive review, I am happy to announce that based on changes on how face down cards are now treated (changes which happened back in 2013), Split Altar now shuffles all artifacts, not just those that are active.

The REG states:
Quote
The only known attribute of a face down card is the card type. Face down cards are only targetable by abilities that specify they can target face down cards or inactive artifacts, or cards that can target any or all cards in a location.

Because the card type of a face down card is a known attribute (so face down artifacts are known to be artifacts) and because Split Altar targets all artifacts in locations that are in play (Artifact pile and territory), Split Altar does indeed now work as originally intended.

Furthermore, in the 5.0 REG update we will be adding a "Locations" entry to the glossary--something we realized was not codified during this review process. Locations include: deck, discard, hand, territory, Artifact pile, Field of Battle, battle (referring to the current battle), Land of Bondage, Land of Redemption, set aside area, Banish pile and Reserve pile.

Many thanks to the PSA of Minister Polarius and the keen eye of Thomas Hunter for bringing this to light.  :thumbup:




P.S. Someone run and tell STAMP...maybe he'll decide to dust off his collection.  8)
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Fortress Alstad
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kariusvega

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are still in your territory
« Reply #16 on: July 03, 2017, 02:03:58 AM »
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Quote from: The Guardian on July 03, 2017, 01:44:57 AM

Furthermore, in the 5.0 REG update we will be adding a "Locations" entry to the glossary--something we realized was not codified during this review process. Locations include: deck, discard, hand, territory, Artifact pile, Field of Battle, battle (referring to the current battle), Land of Bondage, Land of Redemption, set aside area, Banish pile and Reserve pile.

awesome love this !!
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Adevine

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are in play -- Rule announcement on Split Altar
« Reply #17 on: July 03, 2017, 07:36:52 AM »
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 +1
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Offline Bobbert

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Re: PSA: Face-down artifacts are in play -- Rule announcement on Split Altar
« Reply #18 on: July 03, 2017, 10:32:55 AM »
+3
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