Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Enoch (Pa)
Type: Hero Char. • Brigade: White • Ability: 7 / 8 • Class: None • Special Ability: Enoch may be removed from the game, but is prevented from being discarded. • Errata: Protect Enoch from discard. • Identifiers: OT Male Human, Prophet • Verse: Genesis

Magic Charms (TP)
Type: Artifact • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: Protect your Magicians from capture and conversion. You may discard this card from your Magician during battle to capture up to two human Heroes. • Play As: Protect your Magicians from capture and convert abilities. You may discard this card from your Magician during battle to capture up to two human Heroes.

Words of Encouragement (Ki)
Type: Hero Enh. • Brigade: White • Ability: 4 / 3 • Class: None • Special Ability: Holder may interrupt the battle, draw 3 cards, and play the next enhancement. • Play As: You may interrupt the battle, draw 3 and play an enhancement

Grapes of Wrath (TP)
Type: Lamb • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: Discard an evil card in battle to shuffle all remaining characters in battle into owners’ decks. If the current rescuer doesn't have the most Redeemed Souls, he may begin a new battle. • Errata: Discard an evil card in battle to shuffle [return] all remaining characters in battle into owners’ decks. If no Heroes remain in battle and the current rescuer doesn't have the most Redeemed Souls, he may begin a new battle.

My opponent makes a RA with Enoch. I block with a Magician with Magic Charms activated on it. I use Magic Charms Capture ability. My opponent then interrupts the battle with with Words of Encouragement. If Grapes of Wrath is played at this point whats happens?

You cannot interrupt an Artifact.

You can, if it's in battle with an ITB.  If no other white enhancement is played, Words finishes, and Charms capture resumes.  Grapes can be played, but it won't save Enoch.

Just to confirm, Charms can definitely be interrupted by an ITB ability as long as the Magician holding it is in battle. However, dominants do not work in the way you described in your scenario. They cannot be played until an ability has finished. In this case, that ability is Words of Encouragement, which is (roughly) "Interrupt the battle, draw three cards, play next enhancement." Thus, the battle (and Charms) interrupts, you do or don't draw, and then you have the option to play the next enhancement. If you do, that special ability activates, and then the battle continues. This means that after the interrupt the battle ability, when nothing happens to remove either Charms or the magician, Charms kicks back in and captures.

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on January 28, 2012, 06:55:00 PM

when nothing happens to remove either Charms or the magician

I'm not so sure about this part. Charms isn't an enhancement activated on a Magician and trying to resolve, it's an artifact that was already active and is using a triggered ability to accomplish something. Would getting rid of the Magician really stop Charms? If so, why?

I would say getting rid of the magician would get rid of the charms, because you interrupted the charms, then you removed the magician it was placed on, so the charms follows.

Magic Charms wouldn't be Discarded if the Magician was captured, it would just fizzle because it's no longer "your" magician.

Quote from: Minister Polarius on January 28, 2012, 11:53:27 PM

Magic Charms wouldn't be Discarded if the Magician was captured, it would just fizzle because it's no longer "your" magician.

I thought placed cards on captured characters were discarded?

Same here.  Though Activated != placed, it seems similar enough to me.

I don't believe placed cards are discarded, just weapons.

This is what I had thought as well, but I'm by no means an expert on the rules.

Quote from: browarod on January 28, 2012, 08:17:38 PM

Quote from: Chronic Apathy on January 28, 2012, 06:55:00 PM

when nothing happens to remove either Charms or the magician

I'm not so sure about this part. Charms isn't an enhancement activated on a Magician and trying to resolve, it's an artifact that was already active and is using a triggered ability to accomplish something. Would getting rid of the Magician really stop Charms? If so, why?

It would depend on where the magician was being removed to. My understanding is that Charms can activate from Set-Aside, and obviously it can from territory, so if it was sent to either of those two places, it could still activate. However, if the magician is sent to hand or deck, or discarded, or captured, Charms would go with the magician (unless captured, in which case, it's discarded).

Type: Artifact • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: Protect your Magicians from capture and conversion. You may discard this card from your Magician during battle to capture up to two human Heroes. • Play As: Protect your Magicians from capture and convert abilities. You may discard this card from your Magician during battle to capture up to two human Heroes.

Charms says "during battle" so if your magician is set aside or returned to territory, is that still "during battle"?

Bruce, please avoid double posting. =)

To answer your first question, I believe I explained it pretty well earlier in this thread. Dominants activate instantaneously, yes, however, they don't have the ability to interrupt the battle all on their own, and all special abilities must complete before dominants can be played. In the case of Words of Encouragement, it interrupts the battle, lets you draw the three cards, and then play an enhancement. If you choose not to play an enhancement, then Words of Encouragement's ability completes, and then Magic Charms, which was interrupted, gets to finish its special ability. Since Grapes does not interrupt the battle, at no point can it be played until all other abilities have completed. Does that make sense?

As to your second question, Charms doesn't have to in battle to be used, a battle just has to be going on. A common play is to use Charms during your own Rescue Attempt or Battle Challenge to capture your opponent's heroes in territory.