Cactus Game Design Message Boards

which can activate first: The throne of David or go into Captivity?

I can see this both ways. 

At first I thought the blocking trigger happens first.  As soon as the EC enters battle, all "if an EC blocks" abilities must be given the chance to trigger.  Then, all "if an EC is in battle, then you may at any time..." abilities can trigger.  The "if an EC blocks" trigger is already set up.  The arrow is on the string and the arrow is drawn.  All it takes is for the instance of the block to take place.  The "if an EC is in battle" ability is an optional ability that can happen when the blocker chooses, but you don't check for "in battle" triggers until after checking triggers for a "block" action.

But now I see it differently.  The triggers happen simultaneously. The "if EC blocks" happens at the same instance as "EC is in battle."  Since the action of putting the EC into battle caused the simultaneous trigger, the person who performed this action gets first choice to act.  That means GitC can go first, if the blocker chooses.

I think my former thoughts were wrong, but what do you think?

But IMO that would not prevent TToD From activating.  True te King may be captured, But the hero should still be able to draw a card and play an enhancement Because it works on the same prinicipal as the artifact.  Something outside the battle is affecting the outcome.

Let me phrase it this way.  After a character is presented in battle, each player is given the chance to play a Dominant if he is able, and wishes to do so.

Once you present your EC, do I get to play my AotL first or do you get to play your CM first?  Is priority assigned?

Let me phrase it this way.  After a character is presented in battle, each player is given the chance to play a Dominant if he is able, and wishes to do so.

Once you present your EC, do I get to play my AotL first or do you get to play your CM first?  Is priority assigned?

im not quite sure What you are trying to say there schaef..

@ Bryon.  Why cant they both be triggered at the same time.  IN the example above, AOTL can be used at the same time that Cm is used.  True Doms dont need triggers, they can be played at any time, but the conditions of both cards are fulfilled, so who says one has to go before or after the other.  Play GITC at the same time that the hero plays a card.  If it is an interrupt, let it fulfill and then capture the hero.  It just may be that they EC gets beaten up too.

I dont see why they cant both actrivate at the same time.

If that is the case, then throne of David seems useless other then drawing cards, when GitC is in play. 

Are we better off throwing down Ethiopian treasurer and AoCP?

Provided there is no Warrior class character in their hand or on the Darkness, then yeah, that would stop GitC

Tim is right.  Even banding in a bunch of characters.  They are all targeted for band "at the same time" but their abilities activate in the order you move them into battle.  Same thing applies here.  If both cards are triggered at the same time, the player who pulled the trigger (the player who put the EC into battle), gets to decide if he will use GitC.  If he does, then TToD gets to activate.  So, you get to draw.  However, the hero is gone (assuming no banding), so no card can be played.

Let me phrase it this way.  After a character is presented in battle, each player is given the chance to play a Dominant if he is able, and wishes to do so.

Once you present your EC, do I get to play my AotL first or do you get to play your CM first?  Is priority assigned?

This exact question happened at a tournament.  I was not there to determine who played first.  I ruled that the blocker has first chance to respond to his own action.  I've ruled the same when I can't tell who played Son of God first when a Lost Soul is drawn in a 4-4 tie.  Ties go to the guy who was responding to his own action.

In an effort to curb slapjack, I always give first-response to the player whose action pulled the trigger.  Then players can take turns responding with their various cards.

The only question I have is whether these are simultaneous triggers, or if "if EC blocks" and "if EC is in battle" happen consecutively.  I think they are simultaneous.

In an effort to curb slapjack, I always give first-response to the player whose action pulled the trigger.  Then players can take turns responding with their various cards.

This was what I was looking for.  I figured what applied to Dominants applied to (optional) triggered Artifacts.  The consensus of you and Tim on this matter seems to solidify the idea that blocker gets to use GiC first.

I still dissagree, but then again, who am I?   


I believe that just because SOG/NJ are the only ones that currently happen simultaneously, that that does not mean that other things cannot happen simultaneously.  IF the triggers happen at the same time, then why can't both cards activate at the same time.  The worst that can happen would be that both characters are taken out of battle, the block is still successful but at least the Hero has a chance to do some damage.

That is the point of the card correct?  to give heroes a chance to do some damage under the onslaught of all these horsies and killer arts?

They rarely get initiative the old fashioned way. 

Which is why I think that we should revisit this idea that the blocker is the only one that gets to determine the trigger.  I say let them both play.  The EC uses GiTC and the Hero plays ..whatever.   Then the results are tallied and appropriate actions taken.  If there is anything left standing then it wins.  IF both are left standing then it resolves under regular initiative rules.

I also think that TToD should work against an EC that has horsies too but im not gonna hold my breath for that to change.

Forgot that that was a part of the card.

Yeah... I think that's a good rule. Although I did see it the other way... and this is why:

I always thought it was like initiative. Any time someone does something, the opponent gets a chance to act. I also think I remember hearing that if an artifact was activated, you had to give at least a few seconds for your opponent to play a dom, and I think in between doms the same principle applys.

My other reason is that as you said before, TTOD is always ready to go. Go into Captivity you have to manually activate. So I had the impression that since it is ready to go... as soon as the evil character is presented, TTOD activates before your opponent gets a chance to do something manually. They are both triggers, but not both are manuel.

I don't want to start an argument... I just want to make sure that nothing was overlooked, because I could see this in the future, as I typically use royalty.

Do you mean angel of the lord?

yea srry i mean AotL