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Author Topic: Medium in Endor  (Read 2894 times)

Offline sepjazzwarrior

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Medium in Endor
« on: September 15, 2017, 08:15:50 AM »
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Sorry if this has been asked before, but with MiE, does it create special initiative to be able to negate it with the character leaving battle? what if the new character is dying by the numbers?  in a stalemate?

MiE=If blocking, you may exchange a Hero in battle with a Hero in opponent's territory or discard pile. Cannot be prevented if King Saul is in play.
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Offline Kevinthedude

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2017, 09:34:01 AM »
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The exchange itself does not cause special initiative because the result of the ability does not leave you without a Hero in battle. After the ability completes you check initiative like normal, whether that be winning, stalemate, or mutual.
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Offline sepjazzwarrior

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2017, 09:36:11 AM »
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This may be an old ruling but isn't it if you have multiple characters in battle and your opponent discards one, if you have initiative with the remaining character you then get special inish with the discarded character.  Is this still the case?  if it is, then wouldn't that ruling apply to this situation if you have inish after the character has been exchanged?
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Offline Kevinthedude

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2017, 09:42:20 AM »
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Quote from: sepjazzwarrior on September 15, 2017, 09:36:11 AM
This may be an old ruling but isn't it if you have multiple characters in battle and your opponent discards one, if you have initiative with the remaining character you then get special inish with the discarded character.  Is this still the case?  if it is, then wouldn't that ruling apply to this situation if you have inish after the character has been exchanged?

You only get special initiative if an the result of an ability is you having no characters in battle. If I have Joshua (11/9) banded to Captain of the Host (10/10) and they are blocked by Sabbath Breaker (3/2) and Sabbath Breaker discards Captain of the Host with a numberless enhancement, Sabbath Breaker still has initiative because he is still losing by numbers (3/2 vs 11/9). You would not get special initiative because you still have Joshua in battle. If Sabbath Breaker used Scattered instead to underdeck both Joshua AND Captain, then you would have special initiative because the result of Scattered would leave you with no Heroes in battle.
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Offline sepjazzwarrior

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2017, 10:08:06 AM »
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I'm saying its a situation that you have 2 heroes in battle and opponent discards one of them.  by then numbers you now have initiative.  can you negate discard with the hero that just left battle (meaning if the hero left is blue and the one discarded is red, can you use a red negate for instance).  I know that this used to be how it was ruled that you could do that, and I am wanting to verify that this is still how it works and wee if that is how it would work with MiE, if the new hero has inish by the numbers, can you negate MiE with the hero that left battle
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Offline Crashfach2002

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2017, 12:49:12 PM »
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Because abilities have to complete you would not have a chance to play a negate with a removed character if there are 1 or more still in battle.  So say you have White Boaz banded to Purple Elders of the City and I block with Medium in Endor and replace your Boaz with say a Blue Benjamin.  It would be your initiative because it is a stalemate situation.  But, it would not be your special initiative because I didn't remove your last character from battle and you could now only play a white or blue enhancement, not purple.
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2017, 12:51:28 PM »
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Quote from: Crashfach2002 on September 15, 2017, 12:49:12 PM
Because abilities have to complete you would not have a chance to play a negate with a removed character if there are 1 or more still in battle.  So say you have White Boaz banded to Purple Elders of the City and I block with Medium in Endor and replace your Boaz with say a Blue Benjamin.  It would be your initiative because it is a stalemate situation.  But, it would not be your special initiative because I didn't remove your last character from battle and you could now only play a white or blue enhancement, not purple.

^^This is correct.
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Offline Watchman

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2019, 12:03:49 PM »
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I wanted to revisit this thread because I believe the answer to the original question has since been ruled to cause SI if the exchange removes your last Hero from battle.
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Offline Kevinthedude

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2019, 12:10:31 PM »
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Quote from: Watchman on August 14, 2019, 12:03:49 PM
I wanted to revisit this thread because I believe the answer to the original question has since been ruled to cause SI if the exchange removes your last Hero from battle.

I don't see how it can be ruled that Medium gives SI. Special initiative doesn't trigger when your last Hero would be removed, it triggers when an ability would result in you having no Hero in battle after it completes. Medium's ability always leaves you with a Hero in battle when it completes.
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Offline Gabe

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2019, 12:20:41 PM »
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Quote from: Watchman on August 14, 2019, 12:03:49 PM
I wanted to revisit this thread because I believe the answer to the original question has since been ruled to cause SI if the exchange removes your last Hero from battle.

I don't believe exchange or "choose opponent" cause SI for the same reason - both result with you still having a character in battle.
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2019, 12:21:13 PM »
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Quote from: Kevinthedude on August 14, 2019, 12:10:31 PM
I don't see how it can be ruled that Medium gives SI. Special initiative doesn't trigger when your last Hero would be removed, it triggers when an ability would result in you having no Hero in battle after it completes. Medium's ability always leaves you with a Hero in battle when it completes.

Correct--resolving Medium's ability results in a Hero still being in battle so no SI.
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Fortress Alstad
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Offline Watchman

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Re: Medium in Endor
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2019, 12:40:54 PM »
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That’s the part I missed, the completing effect. I thought I saw a post that talked about it causing SI, but I should have read the REG entry first to make sure. If I had I would have seen the competing effect part.

Thanks all.
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