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Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Official Rules & Errata => Ruling Questions => Topic started by: jbeers285 on July 03, 2012, 08:21:03 PM

Title: Lydia
Post by: jbeers285 on July 03, 2012, 08:21:03 PM
Can you use reach of desperation to play words of encouragement to play he is risen or do the interrupts interrupt your own abilities from happening?
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: Warrior_Monk on July 03, 2012, 08:35:17 PM
Reach of Desperation would interrupt Lydia's ongoing ability of being able to play purple enhancements, but you may still play white enhancements such as Words and He is Risen!. You could not however play Words and then Reach, or Words/Reach and then AoCP.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: YourMathTeacher on July 03, 2012, 08:38:00 PM
Reach of Desperation would interrupt Lydia's ongoing ability of being able to play purple enhancements, but you may still play white enhancements such as Words and He is Risen!. You could not however play Words and then Reach, or Words/Reach and then AoCP.

Actually you could as long as you opted out of the interrupt. If you had normal initiative you could choose to not interrupt, but then choose to draw and play next.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: Redoubter on July 03, 2012, 09:58:24 PM
Reach of Desperation would interrupt Lydia's ongoing ability of being able to play purple enhancements, but you may still play white enhancements such as Words and He is Risen!. You could not however play Words and then Reach, or Words/Reach and then AoCP.

Actually you could as long as you opted out of the interrupt. If you had normal initiative you could choose to not interrupt, but then choose to draw and play next.

This is correct, and to expand a little bit on what YMT said, 'may' abilities transfer that 'may' to each part.  So in the case of Reach or Words, which say "You may interrupt the battle, draw 3, and play the next enhancement", what it actually says is "You may interrupt the battle, then you may draw 3, then you may play the next enhancement".

If you decide not to do one part of those type of cards, it does not stop you from using other parts, as each is a 'may'.  However, as YMT alluded to, if it were Special Initiative and you had to choose to use the ITB, it would indeed interrupt the "play other enhancements" ability and you'd be limited to White enhancements on the "play next" option.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: jbeers285 on July 03, 2012, 10:55:44 PM
thats interesting about the transfer of may abilities to every aspect of the ability . . . thanks for the help and clarification
Title: Lydia
Post by: jbeers285 on July 04, 2012, 02:11:16 PM
One more quick question

Can Salome (white heroine)  search for something like I am Mercy

And does I am Mercy stop RBD?
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: YourMathTeacher on July 04, 2012, 02:39:31 PM
One more quick question

Can Salome (white heroine)  search for something like I am Mercy

And does I am Mercy stop RBD?

You will get an answer shortly, but FYI, you would get an answer faster if you posted abilities with the question. You can go to the REG to copy and paste the ability.

-----------------------------

Salome (RA)
Type: Hero Char. • Brigade: White • Ability: 7 / 6 • Class: None • Special Ability: Search deck for The Garden Tomb or a N.T. Covenant and put it in hand. Hero ignores Evil Characters holding weapons. • Play As: Search deck for The Garden Tomb or a N.T. Covenant and place it in hand. Hero ignores all Evil Characters holding weapons. • Identifiers: NT Female Human • Verse: Mark 16:1 • Availability: Rock of Ages booster packs (None)

I Am Mercy (AW)
Type: Covenant • Brigade: Purple • Ability: 2 / 5 • Class: None • Special Ability: Protect holder's hand and draw pile from discard abilities on evil cards. • Identifiers: OT, Involves Music • Verse: Psalms 103:8 • Availability: Angel Wars booster packs (Common)

Rain Becomes Dust (Pi)
Type: Curse • Brigade: Gray • Ability: 1 / 5 • Class: None • Special Ability: All cards that an opponent draws because of a special ability used by that opponent are revealed instead. Place all revealed Lost Souls in opponent’s territory. Discard the rest. • Play As: If an opponent activates a draw ability, reveal the cards instead. Place all revealed Lost Souls in opponent’s territory and discard the rest. • Identifiers: None • Verse: Deuteronomy 28:24 • Availability: Priests booster packs (Uncommon)
Title: Lydia
Post by: jbeers285 on July 04, 2012, 02:48:41 PM
I'm on my phone can't use the reg ATM

Thank u for ur help though
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: YourMathTeacher on July 04, 2012, 02:49:06 PM
First, Salome specifies NT covenant, and I am Mercy is OT.

For your second question, this is from the REG:

Instant Abilities > Draw > How to Play
A draw ability moves the targeted card from the top of a player's deck to that player's hand. All draw abilities are instantaneous. A draw ability targets the cards on top of a player's deck.

Since the target of the draw is on the deck, and RBD is trying to target the same card, and I am Mercy protects the deck, I would argue that I am Mercy protects from RBD. However, I am not an Elder, so you will have to wait for their response.
Title: Lydia
Post by: jbeers285 on July 04, 2012, 03:03:11 PM
My mistake on I Am Mercy, I should checked that first.

Thanks for posting the abilities.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: TimMierz on July 05, 2012, 09:01:36 AM
Rain Becomes Dust has two parts:

If opponent would draw, he reveals instead.
Revealed things are discarded or put into Land of Bondage as appropriate.

I Am Mercy protects from part of the second ability. Cards are revealed, not drawn, and souls are put in the Land of Bondage, and the remainder are placed back on top of the deck, not discarded.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: Minister Polarius on July 05, 2012, 09:05:34 AM
I don't think that's true. That's how I always thought it worked also, but recently there was a big debate about it and iirc it went the other way. The reason is that "instead" is an inverse "cost-benefit" ability. In order to gain the "benefit" of not drawing the cards, you have to be able to pay the whole "cost" of revealing and discarding/sending to play.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: TimMierz on July 05, 2012, 10:43:28 AM
What I said is consistent with ProfessorAlstad in May 2011:

Yes. They are drawn and revealed as they are not protected from the reveal portion.

To clarify, they are not drawn (i.e. they don't go to hand) they are just revealed, and then returned to the top of deck. If Simon the Z's ability is active, then RBD has no effect at all on the deck, and cards are drawn as normal.

Later, in February 2012, he confirmed the Simon part, in a big discussion which may have been what you're talking about, but I don't think it touched on the "protect from discard" part of things:

In summary,
1. RBD will reveal and discard cards that would be drawn by Fishing Boat.
2. Simon will stop RBD from doing anything. Cards are drawn as normal.
3. RBD does not change the ability of Reach in the slightest; it just changes the outcome of Reach having been played.

If you can point me to something else, awesome, but I think what I posted is accurate.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: Professoralstad on July 05, 2012, 11:09:08 AM
I don't think that's true. That's how I always thought it worked also, but recently there was a big debate about it and iirc it went the other way. The reason is that "instead" is an inverse "cost-benefit" ability. In order to gain the "benefit" of not drawing the cards, you have to be able to pay the whole "cost" of revealing and discarding/sending to play.

That is mostly correct. The discard/send to play is not actual part of the instead though, so it's not part of the inverse cost. So all you need to do to pay the inverse cost is reveal the cards, which I am Mercy allows, but from there the revealed cards (which are still technically on the deck) are protected from discard by I am Mercy.
Title: Re: Lydia
Post by: Minister Polarius on July 05, 2012, 12:36:47 PM
Ah yes, now I remember the silly part of that discussion!
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