Author Topic: Long Day (Read 8332 times)

Gabe · « **Reply #25 on:** July 21, 2009, 02:44:15 PM »

Quote from: Red Dragon Thorn on July 21, 2009, 02:14:36 PM

Pot O' Manna has been in my Type 2 deck for years.

Yes, but at NC Regionals we established the fact that you are not sane.

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #26 on:** July 21, 2009, 03:07:14 PM »

Quote from: STAMP on July 21, 2009, 01:25:34 PM

Quote from: BubbleBoy on July 21, 2009, 12:49:33 PM
Essentially, using non-Redemption terms...

Not really. It's a game rule. Just as characters who are */0 or less at the end of battle are discarded, characters who were not defeated withdraw to territory.

Quote from: The Official Redemption Rulebook
Redemption® Rulebook > Diagram of a Turn > Battle Resolution
Stalemate
The rescue attempt ends in a stalemate if neither the Hero(es) nor the Evil Character(s) have enough strength to defeat the other. Both the Hero(es)and the Evil Character(s) withdraw to their respective territories. All enhancements played during the Battle Phase (except set-aside or weapon-class enhancements, or cards placed on other cards during battle) are discarded. No Lost Soul is rescued. This is considered a defeat of the Hero since the Hero was unable to make a successful rescue.

And now that I found that little tidbit, y'all better put Pot O' Manna in your T2 decks for Nats.

"Withdraw" is also used when describing what happens when a battle ends by the numbers or by ignore/repel. The only time characters survive and don't "withdraw" is when all opposing characters are removed from battle via a SA.

STAMP · « **Reply #27 on:** July 21, 2009, 03:12:33 PM »

Excellent. More opportunities.

Korunks · « **Reply #28 on:** July 21, 2009, 03:13:45 PM »

wow side battles are more useful than I thought

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #29 on:** July 21, 2009, 03:16:13 PM »

Quote

Instant Abilities > Withdraw from Battle
Clarifications

• “Opponent must present a new blocker or rescue is successful” is only true if no blockers remain in battle.

• “Withdraw”, “retreat”, “lose their way” “return”, “refuses to block”, and “flee from battle” are the same.

• Many withdraw cards state: “… may withdraw from battle. All enhancements used may be returned to owner’s hand, except this one.”, e.g., Stillness These two sentences are contingent. You may only keep the enhancements if you withdraw from battle.

Actually, based on this quote, all characters that survive the battle withdraw - winning by removal uses "return to territory".

TimMierz · « **Reply #30 on:** July 21, 2009, 03:31:27 PM »

Quote from: RedemptionAggie on July 21, 2009, 03:16:13 PM

• “Withdraw”, “retreat”, “lose their way” “return”, “refuses to block”, and “flee from battle” are the same.

I just checked - no card uses "flee from battle" that I can find.

Kevin Shride · « **Reply #31 on:** July 21, 2009, 05:22:40 PM »

Despite the rulebook actually using the word "withdraw" in defining a stalemate, there is no ability causing the withdrawl. A character may not reenter a battle on the same turn when an ability causes that character to withdraw from battle. Those phrases defining "withdraw" were just listed a couple of posts ago.

In short, stalemate does not equal a withdraw ability.

Kevin Shride

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #32 on:** July 21, 2009, 06:29:19 PM »

That was my understanding also, but I'm not so sure; I've been wrong about a few things lately.

STAMP · « **Reply #33 on:** July 21, 2009, 06:59:19 PM »

Quote from: Kevin Shride on July 21, 2009, 05:22:40 PM

Despite the rulebook actually using the word "withdraw" in defining a stalemate, there is no ability causing the withdrawl. A character may not reenter a battle on the same turn when an ability causes that character to withdraw from battle. Those phrases defining "withdraw" were just listed a couple of posts ago.

In short, stalemate does not equal a withdraw ability.

Kevin Shride

Quote from: Bryon on July 21, 2009, 11:24:37 AM

The REG quote is missing a very important word: NOT. Fixed below.

• If a character is forced to withdraw (e.g., Darkness (Warriors)) or withdraws from a battle voluntarily (e.g., Highway), it may not re-enter the current battle (see Withdraw in the glossary of the rulebook [p. 54]). Moreover, the character may NOT enter on a new battle on the same turn (e.g., The Long Day).

The "Moreover" is a clue that the following phrase will contain an example of the rule, not a counterexample of the rule.

Funny, I don't see the word, "ability", anywhere in the REG quote provided by Bryon.

Gabe · « **Reply #34 on:** July 21, 2009, 07:20:02 PM »

Quote from: STAMP on July 21, 2009, 06:59:19 PM

Funny, I don't see the word, "ability", anywhere in the REG quote provided by Bryon.

That's what happens when you take something out of context and try to apply your own meaning to it. The context of that quote is from the section of the REG designated to the Special Ability Withdraw. Look under Instant Abilities > Withdraw from Battle > Special Conditions. In that context it's certainly talking about special abilities only.

frisian9 · « **Reply #35 on:** July 21, 2009, 07:35:49 PM »

Just a note - I am starting a list of REG changes to show up this weekend. I don't have the ability to upload the changes until this weekend, but am preparing to do so. The added "NOT" is one of the changes. You can follow the changes to be made in the "REG Updates" section of the newsgroup.

Mike

P.S. Thanks Gabe - you are correct and most wise.

STAMP · « **Reply #36 on:** July 21, 2009, 07:44:23 PM »

Guess I'll just have to find another envelope to push.

crustpope · « **Reply #37 on:** May 27, 2010, 10:28:37 AM »

I know this is a necro-post but I want to be clear on something. If someone uses the Long day:

The Long Day
Type: Hero Enh. • Brigade: Blue • Ability: 2 / 1 • Class: None • Special Ability: If holder's rescue attempt this turn fails, holder may make an additional rescue attempt this turn. • Identifiers: None • Verse: Joshua 10:13 •

They can re-enter battle but they have to do it with a different hero,

MOREOVER:

If they use the Longday in combination with stillness:

Stillness
Type: Hero Enh. • Brigade: Blue • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: Hero may withdraw from battle unharmed. All enhancement cards played may be returned to the player's hand except this one. • Identifiers: OT, Involves Music • Verse: Psalms 46:10

All the enhancements that they used in that battle may return to hand. They may begin a new battle but they will have to use a new hero. Correct?

Professoralstad · « **Reply #38 on:** May 27, 2010, 10:53:08 AM »

Yes.

crustpope · « **Reply #39 on:** May 27, 2010, 11:10:36 AM »

Is there a limit to the number of times a long day can be used? The original copy says "a second rescue attempt" that was ruled to just mean "another" correct? If I understand it right you can use it multiple times in a turn as long as you have a different hero each time.

Professoralstad · « **Reply #40 on:** May 27, 2010, 11:16:55 AM »

"Second" was redefined as "additional" for the Warriors version, so both versions do the same thing. You can attack as many times as you want by reuse of A Long Day. It's just a good thing that there is only one green prophet who can play Obedience of Noah at the beginning of a battle...

crustpope · « **Reply #41 on:** May 27, 2010, 11:23:58 AM »

Wel jacob can, but he isnt green and he doens't need Hidden Treasures. Is there a green prophet that can play a blue genesis enhancement?

Professoralstad · « **Reply #42 on:** May 27, 2010, 11:30:51 AM »

Paul is the only one. So you can use Jacob once, and Paul once, and maybe a Provisioned hero once, but it would be a trick to be able to attack more than three times choosing the blocker.

Korunks · « **Reply #43 on:** May 27, 2010, 01:08:47 PM »

I guess I am confused on using Jacob for this, The Long Day is not a genesis enhancement, so you cannot play first?

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #44 on:** May 27, 2010, 01:18:24 PM »

No, Jacob + Obedience of Noah first, THEN play your cards along with The Long Day/Stillness.

crustpope · « **Reply #45 on:** May 27, 2010, 01:20:42 PM »

Quote from: Korunks on May 27, 2010, 01:08:47 PM

I guess I am confused on using Jacob for this, The Long Day is not a genesis enhancement, so you cannot play first?

Yeah, I keep forgetting about Paul. So three guys can play it pre-block.

Quote from: Professoralstad on May 27, 2010, 11:30:51 AM

but it would be a trick to be able to attack more than three times choosing the blocker.

Yeah, that would be a trick wouldn't it

hmmmm....

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #46 on:** May 27, 2010, 01:26:56 PM »

In T1 you could easily do it 5 times...

Jake + Obed of Noah
Paul + Obed of Noah
Provisioned blue hero
lamenting for jepth's daughter on a blue hero
lamenting for jepth's daughter on a blue hero

Professoralstad · « **Reply #47 on:** May 27, 2010, 01:31:18 PM »

Yeah, I'll bet Crustpope is really concerned with how many times he can do it in T1

. And getting Lamenting for Jephthah's daughter to complete is a trick in and of itself.

The other problem is having someone to choose every time. The best thing I could think of would be to have Garrison x5, but black has become pretty common these days...

crustpope · « **Reply #48 on:** May 27, 2010, 01:46:24 PM »

Yeah, I have thought of that. Jonathan and I have come up with two different versions of a deck in the aftermath of the Highway ruling. Now they are going to have to make a "Long Day Ruling." One I am sure will be infinitely less palatable to the PTB than the other. The other may just actually be very effective.

They still need a lot of tweaking and I wouldn't look for them here on the boards anytime soon, but you may just see them at Nats

Professoralstad · « **Reply #49 on:** May 27, 2010, 02:24:51 PM »

Psst, don't email Bryon about them...

Sorry, couldn't resist. No hard feelings I hope.

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Author Topic: Long Day (Read 8332 times)

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo