Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Yes.  It's a different battle, so you can use the same Hero again.

Kevin Shride

I'm going to shoot myself in the foot here and say that no you can't.

Look at the REG quote - The word Moreover would not be used to set up a counter-point, English Syntax simply doesn't allow it, proper syntax would be However. Add the word 'not' between 'may' and 'enter' in that sentence and re-read it. Does it make more sense that way? It is a simple typo putting things into the REG. If this is not the case and you can re-enter battle I am so playing Type 2 at Natz.

It has always been my understanding that a character may not reenter battle during the same battle, but may enter any different battle, even on the same turn.  For instance, if you are forced pre-block to fight two evil characters, you may still use the winning evil character to block the rescue, because it is a different battle.  The same logic applies to The Long Day.

Kevin Shride

So, Bryon, if my opponent forces two of my Evil Characters to fight pre-block, I cannot block the rescue with either of those?

Kevin Shride

So, Bryon, if my opponent forces two of my Evil Characters to fight pre-block, I cannot block the rescue with either of those?

Kevin Shride

If this ends up being tru i think claudia/ET+Cup of Wrath would see a lot more play.

In my opinion, if the REG states something, then it should be played that way. It shouldn't matter if someone else says it, the rules state a fact and should not be changed due to someone saying something else. If this game's rules were constantly open to change because something may seem broken, then it would give new players a hard time understanding rules. I'm sure others would agree with me.

I think it should be played the way the REG says, change the REG, and then I will play it that way.

After talking to Bryon on the phone last night, it was clarified that a character that WITHDRAWS from battle may not reenter battle on that same turn, no matter how many battles take place.  A character who leaves battle in any other manner may not reenter the SAME battle that turn, but may reenter a DIFFERENT battle on the same turn.

So, if you make two EC's fight pre-block, one of them may still block the rescue, assuming that EC didn't withdraw from the side battle.

If you play The Long Day and withdraw from a battle, that character may not reenter the subsequent rescue attempt on the same turn.

If you play The Long Day and lose by stalemate, for example, that same character may begin the second rescue attempt.

Kevin Shride

No, that isn't even close to what the REG says. Just read that quote, it's self-explanatory; it even singles out the example of The Long Day.

Hey, Jeremy, Bryon and Kevin are playtesters.  If they agree on somethings that's about as good as hearing it from Rob himself.  They tend to know what they're talking about.  If something they said doesn't jive with what you see in the REG then maybe their explanation (or the REG) needs better clarification.  What exactly do you think "isn't even close to what the REG says"?

I would propose that two heroes or ECs that fight each other to a stalemate are both considered withdrawing.

The REG quote is missing a very important word: NOT.  Fixed below.

•      If a character is forced to withdraw (e.g., Darkness (Warriors)) or withdraws from a battle voluntarily (e.g., Highway), it may not re-enter the current battle (see Withdraw in the glossary of the rulebook [p. 54]).  Moreover, the character may NOT enter on a new battle on the same turn (e.g., The Long Day).

The "Moreover" is a clue that the following phrase will contain an example of the rule, not a counterexample of the rule.

That is bad, otherwise Hidden Treasures + Sword of the Lord can keep your opponent from block with two of his characters.

Kirk

But it is common sense.  If two characters are fighting a stalemate, and both do not do anything else to win the battle, then they are essentially withdrawing.

Essentially, using non-Redemption terms...

Not really.  It's a game rule.  Just as characters who are */0 or less at the end of battle are discarded, characters who were not defeated withdraw to territory.

Redemption® Rulebook > Diagram of a Turn > Battle Resolution
Stalemate
The rescue attempt ends in a stalemate if neither the Hero(es) nor the Evil Character(s) have enough strength to defeat the other. Both the Hero(es)and the Evil Character(s) withdraw to their respective territories. All enhancements played during the Battle Phase (except set-aside or weapon-class enhancements, or cards placed on other cards during battle) are discarded. No Lost Soul is rescued. This is considered a defeat of the Hero since the Hero was unable to make a successful rescue.

And now that I found that little tidbit, y'all better put Pot O' Manna in your T2 decks for Nats.