Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Official Rules & Errata => Ruling Questions => Topic started by: JDS on July 10, 2012, 09:13:43 PM

Title: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: JDS on July 10, 2012, 09:13:43 PM: "Return all but one Hero in battle to territory." - Herod the Great, Disciples

"If a Hero withdraws from a rescue attempt against holder, place this card beneath owner's draw pile." - Lost Soul, Angel Wars

"The withdraw special ability either allows a character to exit battle unharmed or it forces an opposing character to leave the battle unharmed." - REG, Cactus Game Design

"Retreat and withdraw are treated as "return to territory" if they are not optional and are treated as withdraw if they are optional." - REG, Cactus Game Design

"Huzzah for ambiguity! Now the question is if there is an issue with the wording." - Redoubter, Trumpet Blast!

"Twilight: Eclipse is everything you'd expect from the third installment of the vampire-werewolf love triangle." - Scott Ross, NBC Chicago

My question is, is "return" the same as "withdraw," i.e. would trigger the Acts 23:27 Lost Soul?
Title: Re: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: Redoubter on July 10, 2012, 09:33:57 PM: First, Protect is not the same as Immune. While they do the same thing essentially, the wording is important as far as I know (i.e. Stone of Thebez does not work on characters that are Immune or Ignoring - grants Immune).

I believe that it is the same. Withdraw and retreat and return to territory...I think they all trigger the soul. But I'd get support.
Title: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: jbeers285 on July 10, 2012, 09:41:34 PM: Just to tag an additional question if you make an evil character(s) immune can they still lose by numbers or is that a battle winner? For instance the Magicians snakes played on an Egyptian or magician? Finally can immunity be negated or does immunity prevent negotiation? Sorry for posting an extra question on the original post.
Title: Re: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: Redoubter on July 10, 2012, 09:46:27 PM: Quote from: jbeers285 on July 10, 2012, 09:41:34 PM
Just to tag an additional question if you make an evil character(s) immune can they still lose by numbers or is that a battle winner? For instance the Magicians snakes played on an Egyptian or magician? Finally can immunity be negated or does immunity prevent negotiation? Sorry for posting an extra question on the original post.

- If you are immune to or protected from a character, you are immune to or protected from their numbers as well. This means you cannot be discarded by the numbers while it is in effect.
- Immunity and protection (and by extension ignore) do not stop a card from being targeted by negation or by a place ability.
Title: Re: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: YourMathTeacher on July 10, 2012, 10:14:19 PM: Quote from: Redoubter on July 10, 2012, 09:33:57 PM
I believe that it is the same. Withdraw and retreat and return to territory...I think they all trigger the soul. But I'd get support.

If a withdrawal is not optional, then it is a "return to territory," per the REG quote I gave in the Shoutbox (also is among the quotes in the first post).

If a withdrawal is optional, then it is not a "return to territory."

Herod the Great (Di) would trigger the Acts 23:27 Lost Soul.
Title: Re: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: Minister Polarius on July 10, 2012, 10:34:37 PM: An unconventional type of deck makes use of the new Rescuing rule and the withdraw soul to restrict Lost Soul access. It's risky, but can be a small defense that is effective against meta decks.
Title: Re: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: JohnChristensen on July 10, 2012, 11:02:04 PM: What is this new rescuing rule that you speak of Minister Polarius?
Title: Re: Is withdraw the same as return? Like Protect and Immune?
Post by: Minister Polarius on July 10, 2012, 11:04:57 PM: You can't use SoG or NJ on souls in your LoB. Therefore, if you can keep yours full of souls that either can't be rescued by SoG or present other barriers, you can buy the extra turn or two you need to beat a speed deck.