Author Topic: I am Creator (Read 5307 times)

redemptioncousin · « **on:** December 08, 2009, 03:18:24 PM »

Okay, I know this has come up before, but is I am Creator allowed to trigger when a player enters battle since there is no "upon activation" clause???

I am Creator- "If you do not have a hero in your territory or set-aside area, then search draw pile for a hero and put it in your territory. Cannot be interrupted. Limit once during each of your turns."

Thanks,
Matt

Perri · « **Reply #1 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:27:53 PM »

I believe since it doesn't specify, it's assumed to read "Upon activation", but I could be wrong.

TheKarazyvicePresidentRR · « **Reply #2 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:27:59 PM »

That is the way I always understood it.

SJSharks · « **Reply #3 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:30:42 PM »

It was ruled at Nationals (by Bryon I believe) that it triggers when a player enters battle.

redemptioncousin · « **Reply #4 on:** December 08, 2009, 03:36:50 PM »

...and therefore the reason this should be addressed... 2 people think it doesn't work and 2 people do...

Cameron the Conqueror · « **Reply #5 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:01:36 PM »

It is not an understood "Upon Activation" clause. It can trigger when an RA is made.

TechnoEthicist · « **Reply #6 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:08:52 PM »

Let's get back to the point of the card, it's a Covenant that lets you get a hero out when your hand has been less than kind to you. How could it be used in battle? Where would it fit in the initiative if it's not upon activation?

1. Bob makes RA with hero that can band and no other heroes in play.
2. Weeble blocks.
3. Bob uses the ability from his already active artifact to move a hero to territory who his hero can band in?

Doesn't all banding have to happen before initiative passes? I fail to see the argument...

Cameron the Conqueror · « **Reply #7 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:17:09 PM »

When the single hero is in territory, I Am Creator cannot activate. When the hero enters battle, there is not a hero in "territory or set-aside area" as I Am Creator specifies, and therefore, you can search for a 2nd hero.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #8 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:18:51 PM »

I don't understand why this would be anything other than an ability that activates when the artifact activates. Is it because of the stated once per turn limit?

TechnoEthicist · « **Reply #9 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:28:12 PM »

Quote from: Cameron the Conqueror on December 08, 2009, 04:17:09 PM

When the single hero is in territory, I Am Creator cannot activate. When the hero enters battle, there is not a hero in "territory or set-aside area" as I Am Creator specifies, and therefore, you can search for a 2nd hero.

Agreed, but again, if you have a hero in territory, it can't be used, too bad. I understand also that a hero leaving territory to enter battle has the potential to satisfy the condition, but doesn't the defender get to block before the ability of the covenant would activate and not allowing for a band, or is this akin to Hidden Treasures where the ability is joined with the hero...I guess I am still lost as to why you would want to bring a character to territory while you are going into battle...unless you sacrifice the hero, and if that's the case, do it next turn...

redemptioncousin · « **Reply #10 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:29:53 PM »

But next turn is just that... next turn. You can have a different artifact up and everything.

TechnoEthicist · « **Reply #11 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:31:58 PM »

Ok, I can go with that. So the question is, can the effect of I am Creator be delayed until a condition is met, or does the condition need to be met upon activation...

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #12 on:** December 08, 2009, 05:36:18 PM »

It used to be the case that you could use IamC when your only hero entered battle. However, I remember a thread not too long ago that ruled that this was no longer true.

Gabe · « **Reply #13 on:** December 08, 2009, 05:54:59 PM »

It has always been able to be used when your Hero (or banded Heroes) entere battle.

Tim Maly in his vast understanding of Redemption rules feels it shouldn't work that way. During our game at Nationals, he called Bryon over who stated that it still works during battle, but that might change after Nationals. I have yet to see anything officially stating that it has changed. I expect that's part of the new REG that we're getting closer to seeing each day.

3-Liner And Bags Of Chips · « **Reply #14 on:** December 08, 2009, 09:54:00 PM »

So as of now IamC lets you get and evil character out of your deck when your only hero goes in battle but you cannot band him in. Correct?

Gabe · « **Reply #15 on:** December 08, 2009, 09:59:41 PM »

Quote from: 3-Liner And Bags Of Chips on December 08, 2009, 09:54:00 PM

So as of now IamC lets you get and evil character out of your deck when your only hero goes in battle but you cannot band him in. Correct?

No, it searches for a Hero, not an EC.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #16 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:09:02 PM »

Quote from: BrianGabe on December 08, 2009, 05:54:59 PM

I expect that's part of the new REG that we're getting closer to seeing each day.

There is no new REG. It was all a hoax. That's why the author was listed as "Lucy."

On a related note, recently leaked emails from the "Secret Moderator Boards" detail the coverup and purposefully deceptive misinformation.

Master KChief · « **Reply #17 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:18:23 PM »

new REG: as real as astronauts landing on the moon.

SirNobody · « **Reply #18 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:24:50 PM »

Hey,

We have, since the card was released, allowed players to use it after attacking with their only hero.

If you look at the ability you'll see that it is an instant, conditional, non-optional ability. The rule for instant, conditional, non-optional abilities is that when they activate, if the condition is met they take effect, if not they do nothing. All other such abilities (even ones on other covenants and artifacts) only work when they are activated, there is no provision for a delayed use.

As such, we have been ruling incorrectly since the card was released by saying that players could use it after attacking with their only hero.

This came up a couple weeks before nationals 2009. And the above was the general direction of that thread. It then came up in a game at nationals between Gabe and I. I asked Bryon (the Judge) about it and he said that it is probably true that you shouldn't be allowed to use it as a response to attacking, but that he was going to allow it because that was how it has always been ruled in the past and he didn't want to reverse the ruling at nationals.

This issue will not be addressed in the upcoming REG.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

SirNobody · « **Reply #19 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:25:56 PM »

Hey,

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on December 08, 2009, 10:09:02 PM

There is no new REG. It was all a hoax.

It is by far the greatest hoax I have ever masterminded.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #20 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:27:38 PM »

Quote from: SirNobody on December 08, 2009, 10:24:50 PM

It is by far the greatest hoax I have ever masterminded.

I don't know. I thought the crop circles were pretty good, too.

Red Dragon Thorn · « **Reply #21 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:28:17 PM »

Even better than Angel of Deliverance allowing you to make multiple resuces in one turn

SirNobody · « **Reply #22 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:30:02 PM »

Hey,

Quote from: Red Dragon Thorn on December 08, 2009, 10:28:17 PM

Even better than Angel of Deliverance allowing you to make multiple resuces in one turn

Or Pharaoh's Magicians putting a card from your hand into your hand.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

Sean · « **Reply #23 on:** December 08, 2009, 10:30:22 PM »

Quote from: SirNobody on December 08, 2009, 10:24:50 PM

Hey,

We have, since the card was released, allowed players to use it after attacking with their only hero.

If you look at the ability you'll see that it is an instant, conditional, non-optional ability. The rule for instant, conditional, non-optional abilities is that when they activate, if the condition is met they take effect, if not they do nothing. All other such abilities (even ones on other covenants and artifacts) only work when they are activated, there is no provision for a delayed use.

As such, we have been ruling incorrectly since the card was released by saying that players could use it after attacking with their only hero.

This came up a couple weeks before nationals 2009. And the above was the general direction of that thread. It then came up in a game at nationals between Gabe and I. I asked Bryon (the Judge) about it and he said that it is probably true that you shouldn't be allowed to use it as a response to attacking, but that he was going to allow it because that was how it has always been ruled in the past and he didn't want to reverse the ruling at nationals.

This issue will not be addressed in the upcoming REG.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

Are we going to change the way we play it?

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #24 on:** December 08, 2009, 11:58:44 PM »

Quote from: SirNobody on December 08, 2009, 10:24:50 PM

This issue will not be addressed in the upcoming REG.

So the current ruling is wrong, but the new REG won't address it? Then what will?

News:

Author Topic: I am Creator (Read 5307 times)