Cactus Game Design Message Boards

If I have I am Truth active during battle phase, can my opponent negate I am Truth with Destruction or can it not be negated during that phase since it endows CBN status?

I am Truth - "Good enhancements with ignores in the special ability cannot be negated by evil cards."
Destruction of Nehustan - "Discard one active artifact in play.  Artifact's ability is negated."

Kirk

But I believe this follows the rule that "cards that give CBN status CBN themselves." You could DoN it in a previous phase, though.

Interesting. There have been rulings that stated CBN status is given at the time a card is played and that it would not be dynamic. I agree that I am Truth can be discarded, but could a previously played "ignore" card have its CBN status removed? This would seem to be a case where it would (unless I am Truth was played as an enhancement).

So the real scenario is:

1. I am Truth active as an artifact.
2. RA and block
3. Hero uses an "ignore."
4. Blocker plays DoN to target I am Truth.
5. Blocker now wants to play an interrupt/negate on the "ignore."

Can DoN take away the CBN status of the "ignore" card? I would say that it cannot, since the "ignore" card was granted the ability to "not be negated by an evil card" which DoN is (indirectly). So I am Truth is discarded and cannot be used again, but the "ignore" card sticks, not allowing the Blocker to interrupt/negate the "ignore" card.

What say you? 

Interesting. There have been rulings that stated CBN status is given at the time a card is played and that it would not be dynamic. I agree that I am Truth can be discarded, but could a previously played "ignore" card have its CBN status removed? This would seem to be a case where it would (unless I am Truth was played as an enhancement).

So the real scenario is:

1. I am Truth active as an artifact.
2. RA and block
3. Hero uses an "ignore."
4. Blocker plays DoN to target I am Truth.
5. Blocker now wants to play an interrupt/negate on the "ignore."

Can DoN take away the CBN status of the "ignore" card? I would say that it cannot, since the "ignore" card was granted the ability to "not be negated by an evil card" which DoN is (indirectly). So I am Truth is discarded and cannot be used again, but the "ignore" card sticks, not allowing the Blocker to interrupt/negate the "ignore" card.

What say you? 

I agree you can't don it to remove the CBN status, but you can don it previous to it.

I believe he's saying that it would be negated during the battle phase if you DoN'd it in a previous phase, which I am inclined to agree with.

Hm, Does that apply to artifacts? If so ash pole just got even MORE teeth...

I think those teeth have always been there, we just may not have realized it.

Cards that  “cannot be negated” can never be interrupted, prevented, or negated.

It goes on to provide examples that include characters but that doesn't mean the statement is limited to only characters, it says cards so it would apply to all cards.

I think the first thing we have to establish is whether or not I am Truth can be negated.  I've already quoted the REG showing that "Cards that  “cannot be negated” can never be interrupted, prevented, or negated."  If they only meant characters or only enhancements it would specify only those card types, but instead they chose to use the brood term "cards" to apply to all card types in Redemption.  Esau and Mike are fine examples because they're probably much more common that the example we're looking at.

If that makes sense then continue to read on.  If it doesn't let me know and I'll elaborate.

Assuming we agree on the previous matter, where did the "umbrella" go if the ability wasn't negated?  The ability still lasts until the end of the phase.

Cards with ongoing abilities that are not negated continue until the end of the phase in which they are discarded or removed from battle (in the case of special abilities on characters and enhancements, unless specified otherwise), or discarded or removed from play (in the case of sites, artifacts, fortresses, lost souls, placed cards, etc…).

so its official any artifact that may give something cbn abilities is cbn itself?

so its official any artifact that may give something cbn abilities is cbn itself?

I don't I agree with this. A more accurate restatement would be that any artifact that has made something CBN has given that item CBN status for the remainder of the battle.

So, for example if you activate I Am Truth and then make an RA with a white hero, I can still block and play DoN prior to you playing an enhancement. If you then use an ignore it is not granted CBN status due to the I Am Truth that is sitting in your discard pile. If, however, I do not use DoN immediately and you play an ignore--that ignore is CBN when it is played and DoN'ing I Am Truth does not change that.

(EmJayBee83 posting as JSB23)

Once a card receives CBN status it retains it until the end of the phase.


Another example would be if I blocked with King Zedekiah which gives Dungeon of Malchiah CBN status.  If King Zed is discarded but then I use Unknown Nation to bring in another brown EC and play DoM, it is still CBN.

I think the confusion is caused by the CBN-granting card's disposal prior to a relevant card being played. To put it into JSB (aka MJB) scenario:

1. RA with hero
2. Block with King Zed (whose ongoing SA is to make DoM CBN)
3. Angel of the Lord King Zed
4. Unknown Nation a new brown EC
5. Play Dungeon of Malchiah

To JSB (MJB) - Is DoM CBN? The SA of King Zed has not been negated and therefore remains until the end of the Battle Phase.

The argument for CBN-granting cards is that they cannot be negated themselves, otherwise KoT would negate Michael's SA. So if the CBN-granting ability CBN, it remains until the end of the Battle Phase.

Thanks for that explanation, Matt.  I see what you mean. 

I guess it really depends on whether or not the ability is ongoing or triggered.  If the granting of "cannot be negated" status is triggered when a condition is met (the playing of an enhancement for example) then I could see how it wouldn't work if the card granting the ability was removed from play before the condition is met. 

I personally don't believe that to be the case but I also wouldn't bet the farm on my interpretation.