Author Topic: Dominant slap jack  (Read 8484 times)

Offline SirNobody

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #25 on: June 28, 2010, 02:02:41 PM »
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Hey,

It really all comes down to this: If your opponent performed the last action you cannot deprive him of the opportunity to play a dominant by being physically faster than him.  You can deprive your opponent of the opportunity to play a dominant by being mentally faster than him.

If a player immediately knows they want to respond to their own action with a dominant, they get to.  But each moment they spend deciding if they want to respond with a dominant is an opportunity they give their opponent to sneak a dominant in first.

Technically Son of God and New Jerusalem are the only dominants that can be played at the same time, but if a player wants to use multiple other dominants in immediate succession there's no reason not to let them drop them all at the same time.  Yes Mayhem can't be played until the Lost Souls rescued by Son of God and New Jerusalem are in the Land of Redemption, but after that happens the player that wanted to play Mayhem with Son of God still gets to play it before the opponent can play anything.

With the Lost Souls card the action being responded to is the action of Surrendering a Lost Soul.  The defender chooses which soul to give you (even if there's only one option) that choice/action by the defender is what Burial or Son of God is responding to, thus the defender gets priority.

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Offline Master KChief

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #26 on: June 28, 2010, 03:04:28 PM »
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so if i understand correctly, a player may respond to his own action as many times as he wants with as many dominants/optional use abilities as they choose, and they all get priority before the opponent? like in my previous example, if bob wanted to play 2 different dominants (sog and ht, for sake of argument) in response to his draw, and tom also wanted to play mayhem in response to bobs draw, bob can play both dominants with priority over toms mayhem?
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Offline crustpope

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #27 on: June 28, 2010, 09:23:23 PM »
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It really all comes down to this: If your opponent performed the last action you cannot deprive him of the opportunity to play a dominant by being physically faster than him.  You can deprive your opponent of the opportunity to play a dominant by being mentally faster than him.

If a player immediately knows they want to respond to their own action with a dominant, they get to.  But each moment they spend deciding if they want to respond with a dominant is an opportunity they give their opponent to sneak a dominant in first.

This still is unclear.  I am hearing one thing and MKC is hearing something else.  I hear te words tie in Prof Underwoods example and read "meantally faster than him" in this example and see no superseeding initiative to play dominants issue.

The only problem that I have is this.  Say there is an RA and I have a 2 liner. my intention is to surrender the LS and then bury it.  Should I announce that intention to do so to eliminate the possibility of my opponent sneaking in a SOg/NJ while I move my hand back to my cards to play burial?

In other words, should we announce our intention to respond to our own action when playing dom's to avoid confusion ehen we plan to play multiple doms in this fashion.
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #28 on: June 29, 2010, 12:04:35 AM »
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Usually what people do to "counter" Lost Souls is to turn it horizontally. If they want to bury it immediately, most people I know do the turning with a hand that Burial is already in, so that the turn and the dropping of Burial occurs all in one motion.
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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #29 on: June 29, 2010, 12:20:21 AM »
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Say there is an RA and I have a 2 liner. my intention is to surrender the LS and then bury it.  Should I announce that intention to do so to eliminate the possibility of my opponent sneaking in a SOg/NJ while I move my hand back to my cards to play burial?

In other words, should we announce our intention to respond to our own action when playing dom's to avoid confusion ehen we plan to play multiple doms in this fashion.
I don't think there can be any harm in announcing your intention in this case.  Better communication in cases like this can only lead to less conflict and frustration.

Offline stefferweffer

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #30 on: June 29, 2010, 10:47:32 AM »
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I know I am still new to this compared to others, but I have begun announcing these things and it has worked very well.  I think it would ne nice if everyone started announcing their intentions.  Is there a downside to the "announcing" part that I haven't discovered yet?

Offline Gabe

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #31 on: June 29, 2010, 11:06:04 AM »
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If you announce your intention and follow up with immediately playing the card then I agree. 

The problem comes when you announce your intention and then use that to buy you time to think about what you want to do.  If you do the later and your opponent plays a Dominant while you're thinking, tough luck.
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Offline Minister Polarius

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #32 on: June 29, 2010, 11:09:53 AM »
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Great, as if Dominant play wasn't retarded already, now we get to have shouting matches and he said/she said arguments?
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Offline Alex_Olijar

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #33 on: June 29, 2010, 11:57:19 AM »
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Angel of the Lord is hardly a free soul these days.

Offline crustpope

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #34 on: June 29, 2010, 11:59:04 AM »
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For instance example, YOU CANNOT make two rescue attempts in one turn, grapes allows this.

sounds like someone has not used the long day lately... ::)
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Offline SirNobody

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #35 on: June 29, 2010, 12:53:26 PM »
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Hey,

so if i understand correctly, a player may respond to his own action as many times as he wants with as many dominants/optional use abilities as they choose, and they all get priority before the opponent?

Correct.

The only problem that I have is this.  Say there is an RA and I have a 2 liner. my intention is to surrender the LS and then bury it.  Should I announce that intention to do so to eliminate the possibility of my opponent sneaking in a SOg/NJ while I move my hand back to my cards to play burial?

This is often what I do.  I'll say "give you half of lost souls and bury it" and then go through the motions of doing what I said.  Similarly when I use Unholy Writ I often just say "I'm using Unholy Writ" rather than reaching out to quickly discard the artifact or move the hero to my land of bondage.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly


Offline disciple_drew

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #36 on: February 07, 2011, 09:05:46 PM »
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I had a silly situation earlier today. I was playing a game and I had Mayhem in my hand. It's my opponents turn and while he's on his draw phase (after he has drawn his 3 cards) I ask if he drew any lost souls in which he said no. I slapped down mayhem and he slaps down his entire hand of cards and claims that he can play everything in his hand that is possible to play enters play. (his hand of cards did touch the table before my mayhem touched)

I'd imagine he couldn't because even after his draw it's his upkeep step, then prep phase in which he would be able to play characters, artifacts, and things of the sort. But thats two phases away. I thought this move of desperation was ridiculously funny because it was so stupid in nature but I just want to clear this up.
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Offline Minister Polarius

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2011, 09:08:36 PM »
+2
The only cards he could have played were Dominants.
I am not talking about T2 unless I am explicitly talking about T2. Also Mayhem is fine now somehow!

Offline crustpope

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #38 on: February 07, 2011, 09:49:54 PM »
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And I dont even agree that he could have played dominants unless he followed up your query with a "No because  I am going to play this... " then played his dominant.  Pol is correct that no charaters, enhancements or anything else has a chance to hit the table.
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Offline Red Dragon Thorn

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #39 on: February 07, 2011, 11:10:01 PM »
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I agree with the above posters. Additionally, since this is something that comes up frequently, I am temporarily stickying this thread. I'll also add it to the FAQ thread when I get a chance.
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Offline RTSmaniac

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #40 on: February 08, 2011, 12:21:02 AM »
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sounds like a good idea, questions- im sure will arise time and time again.
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Offline Red

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2011, 02:31:09 PM »
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Oh so I can slap down sog nj after mayhem now? the reason I say this is because someone did that in a game vs me today and mayhem was clearly played first.
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2011, 03:02:47 PM »
+1
Oh so I can slap down sog nj after mayhem now? the reason I say this is because someone did that in a game vs me today and mayhem was clearly played first.

It depends. If you just drew/searched for one or both SoG/NJ and played them immediately, you are responding to your own action, and if you were clearly intending to play them as soon as you got them, then you get priority.

However, if you are not performing such an action, and your opponent plays Mayhem, then you can't out of the blue say that you were planning on playing SoG/NJ and play them.
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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2011, 04:26:01 PM »
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It depends. If you just drew/searched for one or both SoG/NJ and played them immediately, you are responding to your own action, and if you were clearly intending to play them as soon as you got them, then you get priority.

However, if you are not performing such an action, and your opponent plays Mayhem, then you can't out of the blue say that you were planning on playing SoG/NJ and play them.
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Offline crustpope

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2011, 07:01:14 PM »
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I three.  Lets say I have Sog/NJ and I am debating on playing them.  While I am waiting and thinking, My opponent plays Mayhem.  I DO NOT get to play SOg/NJ before I shuffle and draw.  I just lost them..too bad..soo sad.

NOW.  lets say I played false peace to search for NJ when I already have SOG in my hand. After I search and then shuffle my deck (because shuffling the deck is an unwritten part of the SA of any search card), My opponent plays mayhem.  I CAN play SoG/NJ and say.."I am responding to my search"  and then shuffle and draw due to mayhem.

This is a legitimate play
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Offline STAMP

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2011, 08:15:01 PM »
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I three.  Lets say I have Sog/NJ and I am debating on playing them.  While I am waiting and thinking, My opponent plays Mayhem.  I DO NOT get to play SOg/NJ before I shuffle and draw.  I just lost them..too bad..soo sad.

NOW.  lets say I played false peace to search for NJ when I already have SOG in my hand. After I search and then shuffle my deck (because shuffling the deck is an unwritten part of the SA of any search card), My opponent plays mayhem.  I CAN play SoG/NJ and say.."I am responding to my search"  and then shuffle and draw due to mayhem.

This is a legitimate play

How about I play False Peace to search for a lost soul when I already have SoG/NJ in my hand in order to have enough lost souls to rescue?

How about I play False Peace to search for SoG when I already have NJ in my hand, but select MY Mayhem instead and play it (because I noticed I forgot to put SoG in my deck and that's just how I roll)?
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #46 on: July 13, 2011, 09:25:41 PM »
+1
I three.  Lets say I have Sog/NJ and I am debating on playing them.  While I am waiting and thinking, My opponent plays Mayhem.  I DO NOT get to play SOg/NJ before I shuffle and draw.  I just lost them..too bad..soo sad.

NOW.  lets say I played false peace to search for NJ when I already have SOG in my hand. After I search and then shuffle my deck (because shuffling the deck is an unwritten part of the SA of any search card), My opponent plays mayhem.  I CAN play SoG/NJ and say.."I am responding to my search"  and then shuffle and draw due to mayhem.

This is a legitimate play

How about I play False Peace to search for a lost soul when I already have SoG/NJ in my hand in order to have enough lost souls to rescue?

How about I play False Peace to search for SoG when I already have NJ in my hand, but select MY Mayhem instead and play it (because I noticed I forgot to put SoG in my deck and that's just how I roll)?

If it were anyone but you, I would rule in the favor of the person using False Peace in both situations. If it were you, I'd definitely rule in favor of your opponent...because that's how I roll... ;)
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Offline STAMP

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #47 on: July 13, 2011, 10:10:55 PM »
+1
But what if my opponent was...

DUH, Duh, duh...

...MJB...and we were BOTH playing ANB decks.   :o
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #48 on: July 13, 2011, 11:37:35 PM »
+3
But what if my opponent was...

DUH, Duh, duh...

...MJB...and we were BOTH playing ANB decks.   :o

Hmmm....that's a tough one. I'd probably have to flip a coin. Or just disqualify you both.
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Offline crustpope

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Re: Dominant slap jack
« Reply #49 on: July 15, 2011, 12:09:04 PM »
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If it were me i'd rule for both of you and promote you all to redemption elder.  The redemption boards needs more AnB ;)
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