Author Topic: Deafening Spirit vs. CoD (Read 9772 times)

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #25 on:** December 17, 2011, 03:18:57 PM »

Quote from: megamanlan on December 17, 2011, 02:57:57 PM

As to REP's, then where is that mentioned? I've never seen that.

The card's ability. It says it becomes an evil character. It doesn't say it is an evil character.

megamanlan · « **Reply #26 on:** December 17, 2011, 06:42:22 PM »

Actually it says that it's Treated as a Character. And still, I see that everyone says that they are not sure on the ruling.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #27 on:** December 17, 2011, 06:57:56 PM »

Quote from: megamanlan on December 17, 2011, 06:42:22 PM

Actually it says that it's Treated as a Character. And still, I see that everyone says that they are not sure on the ruling.

Funny how Alex and I had no qualms about our ruling. Are we not part of "everyone?"

megamanlan · « **Reply #28 on:** December 17, 2011, 10:11:27 PM »

As far as I see, Alec hasn't given an opinion on this ruling and I seem to remember that u said u weren't 100% sure.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #29 on:** December 17, 2011, 10:36:01 PM »

Quote from: megamanlan on December 17, 2011, 10:11:27 PM

As far as I see, Alec hasn't given an opinion on this ruling and I seem to remember that u said u weren't 100% sure.

Alex's opinion:

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on December 17, 2011, 02:01:47 PM

Browarod and Chronic are both REPs. And they are right.

Where did I say I wasn't sure?

megamanlan · « **Reply #30 on:** December 17, 2011, 10:57:30 PM »

Okay, u didn't but everyone else did. Once again, this doesn't prove the point. Pls note that no one is sure how this works, and I'd rather know exactly if it is CBI or not instead of assuming something and then it would come back to bite me later.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #31 on:** December 17, 2011, 10:59:12 PM »

No one but you has said it's CBI. Everyone has said that it becomes a character with no SA. Both Alex and I said without clause that we believed this was so.

megamanlan · « **Reply #32 on:** December 17, 2011, 11:17:02 PM »

That's what Scott said, because the card doesn't say it's a no-effect Character. It says that it's treated as a Character (vs. Doubt which says that it's a no-effect card.)

SomeKittens · « **Reply #33 on:** December 17, 2011, 11:31:07 PM »

Quote from: megamanlan on December 17, 2011, 11:17:02 PM

That's what Scott said, because the card doesn't say it's a no-effect Character. It says that it's treated as a Character (vs. Doubt which says that it's a no-effect card.)

He said that it was effectively CBI. There's a difference.

megamanlan · « **Reply #34 on:** December 18, 2011, 12:46:18 AM »

In otherwords it's like the current ruling on End the Battle cards?

Irish_Luck · « **Reply #35 on:** December 18, 2011, 10:24:08 AM »

I agree with Kittens. Since the part about turning into a character is last, it is a character with no special ability.

megamanlan · « **Reply #36 on:** December 18, 2011, 01:49:57 PM »

Remember it's 'Treat as' not 'this card becomes' and my understanding of that is like w/ Curses and Covenants u can treat it as an Artifact or a Enhancement. Either way it still holds it's ability.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #37 on:** December 18, 2011, 01:54:33 PM »

Quote from: megamanlan on December 18, 2011, 12:46:18 AM

In otherwords it's like the current ruling on End the Battle cards?

No. This is effectively CBI because the special ability (on the enhancement) is no longer targetable.

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #38 on:** December 18, 2011, 02:33:31 PM »

So what about Negate All cards or negate last enhancement cards?

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #39 on:** December 18, 2011, 02:46:05 PM »

Quote from: RTSmaniac on December 18, 2011, 02:33:31 PM

So what about Negate All cards or negate last enhancement cards?

I'm quite sure that in the case of the latter option, if Deafening Spirit does indeed become an evil character for the turn (which should be announced after playing the card), then a negate last enhancement card has no effect on it. Since DS is inherently CBI, negate all cards or interrupt the battle also wouldn't work.

megamanlan · « **Reply #40 on:** December 18, 2011, 03:57:51 PM »

That is more of the answer that I was looking for. Because that was questioned in a fun round against a friend, where that came up.

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #41 on:** December 18, 2011, 04:35:13 PM »

That's never been a debate, and there's been a broad consensus about that. What's slightly more up in the air is the first part of the ability, and even then, most of us are relatively sure.

megamanlan · « **Reply #42 on:** December 18, 2011, 05:13:21 PM »

Well, the First part is the one that I'm more concerned about, if it's treated as a Character then would CoD stop that? The part of becoming a character makes little difference to me.

SomeKittens · « **Reply #43 on:** December 18, 2011, 06:32:12 PM »

Quote from: megamanlan on December 18, 2011, 05:13:21 PM

Well, the First part is the one that I'm more concerned about, if it's treated as a Character then would CoD stop that? The part of becoming a character makes little difference to me.

No, CoD does not stop that. That's what we've all been saying all along.

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #44 on:** December 18, 2011, 09:50:12 PM »

Deafening Spirit
1/4 Orange Evil Enhancement
Mark 9:25, Generic, Demon
Negate and discard the Last Good Enhancement played this Battle. You may treat this card as an Evil Character until the end of battle.

I want you to imagine a similar card...
Non-existent Spirit
1/4 Orange Evil Enhancement
Hezekiah 11:27, Generic, Demon
Negate and discard the Last Good Enhancement played this Battle. This card becomes an Evil Character.

I think we would all agree that if this card survived it's first battle that it would return to territory as an EC with the SA to "negate and discard the last GE played in battle" (which would be nice against Ethiopian Treasurer or a hero with a WC-GE). This indicates to me that when a "card" becomes an EC, then the SA remains on the card (except perhaps the transforming part which would become redundant).

megamanlan · « **Reply #45 on:** December 19, 2011, 02:59:30 PM »

So does that mean that CoD negates Deceving Spirits Negate and Discard Ability?

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #46 on:** December 19, 2011, 03:02:45 PM »

In that case Underwood, I would argue that there should be a specific game rule that declares that cards like Deafening Spirit should be CBI, because right now, making a ruling on that assumption, and then having the first half of it be unnegatable, seems extremely inconsistent.

megamanlan · « **Reply #47 on:** December 19, 2011, 03:25:41 PM »

I really don't like CBN Negate & Discard abilities, (or CBI) but what he's saying is that becoming a Character is inherently CBI but the Character still keeps that ability.

galadgawyn · « **Reply #48 on:** December 20, 2011, 02:04:22 PM »

Well I don't agree with the majority; I think Prof U is on the right track.

Quote

That's never been a debate, and there's been a broad consensus about that.

That is just wrong. I specifically remember a ruling where a negate last enhancement would work against Deafening Spirit, just like it works against an enhancement in the discard pile. Most negate enhancement cards can't target it because it is now an evil character but negate the last can.

and if Prof U is right then any card that can negate the evil character would also negate it.

megamanlan · « **Reply #49 on:** December 21, 2011, 05:23:20 PM »

Now were getting somewhere, I was getting irritated with people just saying things w/o giving any history or at least telling me what the 'official ruling' is on it.
Instead I get people just saying that trying to find the truth is problematic or is not the way to influence people and make friends.

News:

Author Topic: Deafening Spirit vs. CoD (Read 9772 times)

Chronic Apathy

Chronic Apathy

Chronic Apathy