Author Topic: Chariot of Fire (Read 2253 times)

Warrior_Monk · « **on:** December 13, 2012, 03:03:35 PM »

This was asked in another thread, but never got an answer (even after being bumped several times), so to bring it to the attention of the Elders, I decided to start a new thread.

Chariots of Fire reads "Following your rescue attempt..."

In all of the following examples, I have Chariot of Fire active.

1. If my opponent has one lost soul in a green site, and I rescue with a red hero, and my opponent doesn't block, does Chariot of Fire activate?

2. If I make a rescue attempt and my opponent uses Uzzah, does Chariot of Fire activate?

3. If I make a rescue attempt and my opponent plays DoU, does Chariot of Fire activate?

Gabe · « **Reply #1 on:** December 13, 2012, 03:59:27 PM »

A battle can switch back and forth between being a rescue attempt and battle challenge several times. If at any time during the battle it is or was a rescue attempt, then Chariot of Fire will take effect.

Platinum_Angel · « **Reply #2 on:** December 13, 2012, 04:32:55 PM »

Does Chariot of Fire take affect after the battle phase?

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #3 on:** December 13, 2012, 05:53:30 PM »

Quote from: Gabe on December 13, 2012, 03:59:27 PM

A battle can switch back and forth between being a rescue attempt and battle challenge several times. If at any time during the battle it is or was a rescue attempt, then Chariot of Fire will take effect.

So, that's a yes for DoU and Uzzah. What about the site?

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 04:32:55 PM

Does Chariot of Fire take affect after the battle phase?

I believe it takes effect during Battle Resolution.

Gabe · « **Reply #4 on:** December 13, 2012, 06:49:28 PM »

Quote from: Westy on December 13, 2012, 05:53:30 PM

So, that's a yes for DoU and Uzzah. What about the site?

I know that you know the difference between a rescue attempt and battle challenge, Andrew. I don't understand the point of your question.

Master KChief · « **Reply #5 on:** December 13, 2012, 06:53:02 PM »

Regardless if Andrew knows the difference or not, you should answer for the benefit of others.

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #6 on:** December 13, 2012, 06:58:50 PM »

Quote from: Gabe on December 13, 2012, 06:49:28 PM

I know that you know the difference between a rescue attempt and battle challenge, Andrew.

I'm not sure I do.

Rescue Attempt "A rescue attempt is the effort to recover a Lost Soul from the Land of Bondage by battle. The battle is considered a rescue attempt if a Hero has access to a Lost Soul at any point in the battle."

Battle Challenge: "A battle challenge may be given when there is no Lost Soul available for a Hero to rescue."

I've always understood available and access to have different meanings. Access would be primarily dealing with sites, but possibly also dealing with protection (a la Uzzah and N.T. Lost Soul [which should have been asked about instead of Uzzah]). Available just means that they have a lost soul in their land of bondage. However, based on my interpretations of access and available, there would be a third, unnamed, type of battle. So which of my interpretations are wrong?

The DoU part was mostly to confirm that a Rescue Attempt cannot turn into a Battle Challenge, but a Battle Challenge can turn into a Rescue Attempt.

Platinum_Angel · « **Reply #7 on:** December 13, 2012, 09:16:43 PM »

Quote from: Westy on December 13, 2012, 05:53:30 PM

Quote from: Gabe on December 13, 2012, 03:59:27 PM
A battle can switch back and forth between being a rescue attempt and battle challenge several times. If at any time during the battle it is or was a rescue attempt, then Chariot of Fire will take effect.
So, that's a yes for DoU and Uzzah. What about the site?

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 04:32:55 PM
Does Chariot of Fire take affect after the battle phase?
I believe it takes effect during Battle Resolution.

So can i return my hero i just used in battle?

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #8 on:** December 13, 2012, 10:35:33 PM »

Quote from: Westy on December 13, 2012, 05:53:30 PM

Quote from: Gabe on December 13, 2012, 03:59:27 PM
A battle can switch back and forth between being a rescue attempt and battle challenge several times. If at any time during the battle it is or was a rescue attempt, then Chariot of Fire will take effect.
So, that's a yes for DoU and Uzzah. What about the site?

I agree with Gabe. And as for the site question, if you attack with a red hero (lacking site access) and your opponent's only LS is in a green site, then that is a battle challenge only at that point. So if your opponent doesn't block allowing you to do something that gives you access, then it is never a rescue attempt, and Chariot of Fire would NOT work.

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 09:16:43 PM

So can i return my hero i just used in battle?

~~I don't think so. I've always seen it played that only heros in the discard from events prior to the current battle are shuffled back in.~~ Sorry about that, I'll go with Gabe on this one as well and say that all heroes (including the ones that just lost) get shuffled back in. I think I was confused because I was thinking of end the battle enhs like Forgotten History that can NOT remove the heroes that they just beat from the discard pile. Or at least that's how I've seen that played.

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #9 on:** December 13, 2012, 10:52:53 PM »

So to clarify protection since my first example with Uzzah was a bad one, if my opponent's only lost soul is the N.T., and I rescue with an O.T. hero, is it considered a "rescue attempt"?

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 09:16:43 PM

So can i return my hero i just used in battle?

Sure can.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #10 on:** December 14, 2012, 12:05:47 AM »

Quote from: Prof Underwood on December 13, 2012, 10:35:33 PM

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 09:16:43 PM
So can i return my hero i just used in battle?
I don't think so. I've always seen it played that only heros in the discard from events prior to the current battle are shuffled back in.

Quote from: Westy on December 13, 2012, 10:52:53 PM

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 09:16:43 PM
So can i return my hero i just used in battle?
Sure can.

Ummmm...... these are polar opposite answers. I would hope after all these years that there is a consistent answer for this question.

Platinum_Angel · « **Reply #11 on:** December 14, 2012, 12:17:35 AM »

Quote from: Prof Underwood on December 13, 2012, 10:35:33 PM

Quote from: Westy on December 13, 2012, 05:53:30 PM
Quote from: Gabe on December 13, 2012, 03:59:27 PM
A battle can switch back and forth between being a rescue attempt and battle challenge several times. If at any time during the battle it is or was a rescue attempt, then Chariot of Fire will take effect.
So, that's a yes for DoU and Uzzah. What about the site?
I agree with Gabe. And as for the site question, if you attack with a red hero (lacking site access) and your opponent's only LS is in a green site, then that is a battle challenge only at that point. So if your opponent doesn't block allowing you to do something that gives you access, then it is never a rescue attempt, and Chariot of Fire would NOT work.

Quote from: Platinum_Angel on December 13, 2012, 09:16:43 PM
So can i return my hero i just used in battle?
I don't think so. I've always seen it played that only heros in the discard from events prior to the current battle are shuffled back in.

This is how I have been playing it but I just wanted to clarify. Thank you sir.

Gabe · « **Reply #12 on:** December 14, 2012, 12:32:59 AM »

Any Hero discarded during the battle, by special ability or by the numbers, would be shuffled by Chariot of Fire after the battle assuming the battle was a rescue attempt at any point.

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #13 on:** December 14, 2012, 01:20:18 AM »

Quote from: Westy on December 13, 2012, 10:52:53 PM

So to clarify protection since my first example with Uzzah was a bad one, if my opponent's only lost soul is the N.T., and I rescue with an O.T. hero, is it considered a "rescue attempt"?

I would rule the same way. Your OT hero has no chance to rescue the NT LS, therefore it is only a battle challenge, and Chariot of Fire would not work unless I blocked and you did something to negate the soul or band in a NT hero, etc. to turn it into a rescue attempt.

Platinum_Angel · « **Reply #14 on:** December 14, 2012, 08:54:47 AM »

Quote from: Gabe on December 14, 2012, 12:32:59 AM

Any Hero discarded during the battle, by special ability or by the numbers, would be shuffled by Chariot of Fire after the battle assuming the battle was a rescue attempt at any point.

Oh!!??!! Ok. Thats actually cool!! Ty sir.

STAMP · « **Reply #15 on:** December 14, 2012, 12:31:07 PM »

How is this being ruled for rescuer's choice in Type 2? Does a declaration count for setting the state of battle to "rescue attempt"? And if so, if I present a hero that does nto have access to that selected LS, do I trip the trigger for failed rescue attempt if my opponent doesn't block?

browarod · « **Reply #16 on:** December 14, 2012, 05:20:51 PM »

I'm not an expert on T2 but I believe choosing the soul you are going for is part of battle declaration (i.e.: the battle isn't officially started until it's chosen) so choosing a soul you don't have access to would be the same as if they only have souls you don't have access to in T1 and, thus, be only a battle challenge.

STAMP · « **Reply #17 on:** December 14, 2012, 05:24:50 PM »

Quote from: browarod on December 14, 2012, 05:20:51 PM

I'm not an expert on T2 but I believe choosing the soul you are going for is part of battle declaration (i.e.: the battle isn't officially started until it's chosen) so choosing a soul you don't have access to would be the same as if they only have souls you don't have access to in T1 and, thus, be only a battle challenge.

That's how I've ruled it for years. But with all the recent changes I just wanted to be sure this hadn't also changed.

Professoralstad · « **Reply #18 on:** December 15, 2012, 12:10:34 AM »

Browarod is correct on the Rescuer's Choice question. A battle is a rescue attempt if there was ever a Hero in battle that had access to a Lost Soul during that battle. If that condition is/was met at any point, then CoF will work. If the condition was never met, then CoF won't work.

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Author Topic: Chariot of Fire (Read 2253 times)

Warrior_Monk

Warrior_Monk

Warrior_Monk

Warrior_Monk

browarod