Author Topic: Changes to Decrease Rules (Read 7158 times)

Gabe · « **on:** August 15, 2011, 12:09:56 AM »

When a special ability reduces a character to */0 or less, the character is immediately discarded (including during battle). Such special abilities create losing by removal. Previously characters were not discarded until the end of the battle phase.

This change makes cards like Hunger work the way many players already interpreted them. It also expands a seldom used ability providing more diversity to the game.

Please visit this post to see all the changes and clarifications for the 2011-2012 tournament season.

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #1 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:13:41 AM »

Crown of Thorns active.
I block with a 3/2 EC from hand and I dont get a chance to play anything before Im discarded?

Red Dragon Thorn · « **Reply #2 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:15:03 AM »

You could play a card that negates the card removing you from battle. So in this case you could play Lying Unto God, or any other Artifact killer based upon the color of the character.

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #3 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:22:44 AM »

You could interrupt the battle with Achan's sin as of now if I understand correctly.

RedemptionAggie · « **Reply #4 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:24:45 AM »

I think that new ITB rule only applies to cards in battle, not all cards effecting the battle.

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #5 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:26:15 AM »

The example was Magic Charms, which doesn't need to be in battle to be used, so I extrapolated that it didn't matter. I guess we will see in the clarification post.

ChristianSoldier · « **Reply #6 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:31:13 AM »

In Gabe's original post it said it would interrupt a Magic Charms on a Magician IN BATTLE.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #7 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:54:50 AM »

This is super sweet. I assume protect from discard will protect from discard by decrease, right?

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #8 on:** August 15, 2011, 01:07:17 AM »

1. @ BB, it always did.
2. It seems to me like the "clarifying text" status is being removed from certain cards that actually say "If defense becomes zero or less, Discard." I could be interpreting this incorrectly, but I don't believe putting Pharisees into battle with Crown of Thorns active would immediately Discard them.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #9 on:** August 15, 2011, 01:09:41 AM »

Quote from: Minister Polarius on August 15, 2011, 01:07:17 AM

I could be interpreting this incorrectly, but I don't believe putting Pharisees into battle with Crown of Thorns active would immediately Discard them.

This seems pretty cut and dry here:

Quote

When a special ability reduces a character to */0 or less, the character is immediately discarded (including during battle).

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #10 on:** August 15, 2011, 01:17:02 AM »

Also, this just made trembling demon + crowns combos a whole lot harder.

Wandering Spirit would pull TD out, but he goes to your territory first, and dies immediately before he can be banded in.

Red · « **Reply #11 on:** August 15, 2011, 08:29:45 AM »

Ok elders thank you. I just got another 7 or so battle winners to tide me over until the new set.

Chronic Apathy · « **Reply #12 on:** August 15, 2011, 09:40:52 AM »

Just to check, if my opponent has Crown of Thorns active and I block with Uzzah from hand, I can still use Uzzah's ability, yes?

Josh · « **Reply #13 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:24:25 PM »

Quote from: Lamborghini_diablo on August 15, 2011, 01:17:02 AM

Also, this just made trembling demon + crowns combos a whole lot harder.

Wandering Spirit would pull TD out, but he goes to your territory first, and dies immediately before he can be banded in.

But the whole process of revealing bottom card - putting it in territory - adding to battle is all part of WS' ability. Can a character die by decrease during the carrying-out of a special ability that has not resolved yet?

Gabe · « **Reply #14 on:** August 15, 2011, 12:31:58 PM »

Those are legit questions and something the elders probably still need to talk through just to ensure we are ruling it the same. My assumption is that a characters ability has to complete once they enter battle, then they will be discarded if their toughness is */0 or less. Feel free to rule that way today and I'll get back to you once we've had a chance to talk it through in more detail.

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #15 on:** August 15, 2011, 01:25:23 PM »

REG

Quote

Ongoing Abilities > Increase or Decrease Abilities

Clarifications
Abilities worded "worth X/X if..." are considered increase or decrease abilities.

The phrase "if result is */0 or less, discard Hero [or Evil Character]" on increase or decrease abilities cards is a clarification reminding players of the game rule that discards such heroes, not a discard special ability.

new REG needs fix

Gabe · « **Reply #16 on:** August 15, 2011, 01:27:38 PM »

Quote from: RTSmaniac on August 15, 2011, 01:25:23 PM

new REG needs fix

That's true of almost all the changes/clarifications I announced last night.

Professoralstad · « **Reply #17 on:** August 15, 2011, 03:28:08 PM »

Quote from: Gabe on August 15, 2011, 12:31:58 PM

Those are legit questions and something the elders probably still need to talk through just to ensure we are ruling it the same. My assumption is that a characters ability has to complete once they enter battle, then they will be discarded if their toughness is */0 or less. Feel free to rule that way today and I'll get back to you once we've had a chance to talk it through in more detail.

I agree with Gabe's assumption. AFAIK, no game action or trigger can take place during the completion of an active special ability.

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #18 on:** August 15, 2011, 04:01:48 PM »

I agree with ProfA.

Josh · « **Reply #19 on:** August 15, 2011, 09:11:27 PM »

So WS/TD/Crown of Thorns still works. Or, is as easy as it used to be.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #20 on:** August 15, 2011, 10:38:17 PM »

I agree with RTSmaniac.

STAMP · « **Reply #21 on:** August 17, 2011, 03:57:28 PM »

Sooo...a decrease is BOTH an ongoing AND instant ability. Bravo.

lightningninja · « **Reply #22 on:** August 17, 2011, 04:08:34 PM »

This is awesome. I'm so happy about this ruling, finally a decrease deck could become popular...

galadgawyn · « **Reply #23 on:** August 18, 2011, 07:49:48 PM »

Is there some general rule about infinite loops? If not, there should be.

It would be pointless but if you block with Wandering Spirit, use Gates of Hell to reveal and place a low number demon in territory with Crown of Thorns active, then it is placed under deck and you repeat.

RTSmaniac · « **Reply #24 on:** August 18, 2011, 08:59:34 PM »

you should choose a number and declare that many cycles.

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Author Topic: Changes to Decrease Rules (Read 7158 times)

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo

Chronic Apathy