Cactus Game Design Message Boards

I've been talking with other elders about the way we handle CBN cards that are cascade negated. We haven't yet found a lot of documentation on this topic and the discussion is not over yet so please bear with us. We all share the same basic understanding of how the game handles these things though.

Tradition says that Enhancements and Dominants that are CBN stay in their present location even when cascade negated.

Example 1: Jeiel (1/1 white Hero) has initiative, plays Spirit as a Dove (no JtB in play) to get Son of God, still has initiative but plays Son of God, then uses initiative to play Blessings (negate all). Son of God does not go back to deck, it was played and remains in the discard pile (the Soul it rescued remains in the Land of Redemption).

Example 2: In Josiah's example above he used Dull to get Stone of Thebez (RA) and plays it on a Canaanite female making it CBN. If Dull is negated (SoG, 3 Woes, etc) Stone of Thebez stays in play on the female Canaanite.

Tradition says that characters which are CBN do NOT stay in in their current location if they are cascade negated (but the effect of their special ability remains).

Example 1: Messenger of Stan (Ap) band to Gomer (TexP) (no Hosea in play) who bands to King of Tyrus. KoT has negated Messengers band, but he stays in battle because Gomer banded to him which is CBN. Gomer on the other hand is kicked out of battle because of the cascade negate.

Example 2: AUTO draws and exchanges to deck for a judge. The Dull LS is triggered and it's owner picks Foreign Wives, then blocks with her making FW CBN protected from the opponent. If the Dull LS is negated, FW is returned to deck. The opponent did not target her but was able to circumvent the targeting by negating the ability the searched her out of the deck.

I'm sure this will raise more questions. Please ask them but don't expect answers right away. As I mentioned above we're doing our best to make sure this is well vetted.

Play abilities are CBI, but it's commonly stated as "You can't unplay a card".  Just playing You Will Remain during regular initiative should return it to deck.  I'd argue that "Play abilities are CBI" doesn't really mean they're CBI, but that it's something more along the lines of CBP - you can interrupt and prevent a CBP card, and you can "unplay" a card played by a play ability by negating the ability that got it (draw/search/exchange).  But just can't just return a card to hand by negating the play ability.

I've been talking with other elders about the way we handle CBN cards that are cascade negated. We haven't yet found a lot of documentation on this topic and the discussion is not over yet so please bear with us. We all share the same basic understanding of how the game handles these things though.

Tradition says that Enhancements and Dominants that are CBN stay in their present location even when cascade negated.

Example 1: Jeiel (1/1 white Hero) has initiative, plays Spirit as a Dove (no JtB in play) to get Son of God, still has initiative but plays Son of God, then uses initiative to play Blessings (negate all). Son of God does not go back to deck, it was played and remains in the discard pile (the Soul it rescued remains in the Land of Redemption).

Example 2: In Josiah's example above he used Dull to get Stone of Thebez (RA) and plays it on a Canaanite female making it CBN. If Dull is negated (SoG, 3 Woes, etc) Stone of Thebez stays in play on the female Canaanite.

Tradition says that characters which are CBN do NOT stay in in their current location if they are cascade negated (but the effect of their special ability remains).

Example 1: Messenger of Stan (Ap) band to Gomer (TexP) (no Hosea in play) who bands to King of Tyrus. KoT has negated Messengers band, but he stays in battle because Gomer banded to him which is CBN. Gomer on the other hand is kicked out of battle because of the cascade negate.

Example 2: AUTO draws and exchanges to deck for a judge. The Dull LS is triggered and it's owner picks Foreign Wives, then blocks with her making FW CBN protected from the opponent. If the Dull LS is negated, FW is returned to deck. The opponent did not target her but was able to circumvent the targeting by negating the ability the searched her out of the deck.

I'm sure this will raise more questions. Please ask them but don't expect answers right away. As I mentioned above we're doing our best to make sure this is well vetted.

In all fairness these questions seem to have been answered here

There's an important distinction to remember with Soul Seeker's scenario. Asaph makes music stuff CBN by an evil card. In this case, ML is being negated by a good card so YWR returns to deck.

Thanks for all the responses.  From what I'm reading, my opponent and I played the situation out the correct way.  Also, I recognize that there was a faultiness in my thinking that a played card has an inherent CBI.