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Offline SomeKittens

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What makes a good hero?
« on: March 12, 2011, 04:40:11 PM »
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With dozens of contenders, Redemption March Madness has begun.  However, with so many different choices, we're forced to answer a very important question: What makes a hero good?

Food for thought:
What about one that has a very powerful ability, but can be stopped easily?  (*coughignorecough*)
What about a powerful ability that's only useful in limited situations?  (Gold is full of these with Abom)
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Offline SomeKittens

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2011, 04:40:46 PM »
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I'll save ProfU the trouble:
Quote from: Prof Underwood on March 12, 2011, 12:06:18 PM

Best - a card that is awesome in all kinds of different decks.
Great - a card that is critical in a competitive deck.
Good - a card that is decent in a competitive deck or could be used in several different kinds.
Bad - a card that is only good in one kind of deck that isn't even that good.

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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2011, 05:29:03 PM »
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Since my criteria has already been posted I'll give some examples:

Best - Captain of the Host.  He is almost necessary in an Angel deck, but also fits great in a Blue deck (with Jacob) or a Gold deck (with Simeon) or a BTN banding deck or a speed deck, etc.

Great - Thaddeus.  You're not going to put him in a non-Apostle deck (because he wouldn't work), but he is essential in any Apostle deck and currently that kind of deck is one of the best out there.

Good - Lydia.  She is a decent character for a TGT offense due to her ability to play AoCP as well as all the white stuff.  But she's not the best TGT character by far.  However, she also shows up sometimes in Purple offenses, or even speed decks that splash a lot of different colors.

Bad - Centurion at Calvary. He is a NT Red hero with site access.  Red doesn't have a lot of NT, and it's always good to have site access.  So you might put this card in, but the other Centurion is better (because he also negates sites).  And besides everyone knows that you can't win big tournaments with a solid red offense anyway.
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Lamborghini_diablo

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2011, 05:56:29 PM »
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I've seen centurion at calvary win more battles because he negates ALL evil characters.

Heldai - Asahel - Abishai - Centurion at Calvary is hard to beat. Plus, Red doesn't really need to negate sites that much.
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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2011, 07:02:54 PM »
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Quote from: Lamborghini_diablo on March 12, 2011, 05:56:29 PM
I've seen centurion at calvary win more battles because he negates ALL evil characters.

Heldai - Asahel - Abishai - Centurion at Calvary is hard to beat.
Heldai - Asahel - Abishai - the other Centurion would negate all all non-WC characters and ALSO negate the sites.  I'll pick option #2.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2011, 07:40:45 PM by Prof Underwood »
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Lamborghini_diablo

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2011, 07:47:59 PM »
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1. A lot of strong EC's nowadays are WC.
2. Cent at Cap does not negate banding, making it easier for your opponent to fight you by numbers.
3. Why would a band like that need to negate sites? I'm missing something.
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TheHobbit13

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2011, 07:51:04 PM »
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Why do you consider one bad, and the other who, does one slight thing different, (really only gonna help to hit a site protected by CP with RH, and for Herods Dungeon stoppage) a lot better? If i had to choose I would take Calvary because it stops banding and the plethora of Weapon and WC enhancements.
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Offline SomeKittens

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2011, 08:15:40 PM »
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For me, another value is availability.  I run a new playgroup, and most of us don't have complete sets of anything.  A card's much more useful if you actually own it.

/still trying to get them on RTS...
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Lamborghini_diablo

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2011, 08:17:39 PM »
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Trying to get what on RTS, Disciples?
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Offline SomeKittens

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2011, 08:18:36 PM »
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My playgroup.  There's a whole variety of reasons they don't do online...
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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2011, 08:24:02 PM »
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Quote from: TheHobbit13 on March 12, 2011, 07:51:04 PM
Why do you consider one bad, and the other ... a lot better?
Actually considering that Red isn't really a competitive offense, I would consider both Centurions to be bad :)
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TheHobbit13

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2011, 08:28:21 PM »
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I disagree, in type two Red is fairly competitive. Also I am not so sure hero's that are on a losing brigade should be classified as bad right of the bat. For example, Lebron James was regarded as a good player even when cleveland was a bad team as a whole.
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Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2011, 08:57:04 PM »
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Quote from: TheHobbit13 on March 12, 2011, 08:28:21 PM
I am not so sure hero's that are on a losing brigade should be classified as bad right of the bat.
That's a fair objection.  My criteria of course are not official, just the way that I'm choosing to look at this project personally :)
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Rawrlolsauce!

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2011, 12:09:41 AM »
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I'm looking at maximum potential of both the character and the (best) deck it (wants/needs/requires/etc). So Thaddeus is one of the highest beings he has one of the highest potentials as a character and the deck he requires is also relatively strong. Whereas Captain of the Host has a much lower (but still fairly high) potential, and the deck he requires is somewhat better.
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Warrior_Monk

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Re: What makes a good hero?
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2011, 12:19:06 AM »
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I look at versatility, effectiveness, and stoppablility. Stoppability is probably my number one criteria. Sure, Zebby is great, but he's so easy to stop nowadays. Thaddeus is awesome because of high effectiveness, and very low stoppability. Captain is super versatile, but is only moderately effective, and moderately stoppable. FSP is awesome because of high versatility, moderate effectiveness, and very low stoppability (who cares about the special ability).
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