Author Topic: Multiplayer Situation (Read 4731 times)

Warrior_Monk · « **on:** January 14, 2015, 12:26:59 AM »

Not so hypothetical situation.
Player A: 3 Souls
Player B: 3 Souls
Player C: 4 Souls
Player D: 1 Soul

Let's suppose we're playing booster draft. Top table. Winner wins, if you get second you'll take 4th.

You are Player A. It is your turn. Player B has 2 souls in land of bondage, Player A has 1. Player B has no ECs in territory, his hand size is 8. Player C has a few mediocre (O.T.) heroes in territory. You rescue against Player B with an N.T. hero. Player B blocks with Emperor Claudias. You have Abraham's Servant to Ur.

Question A: Do you play Abraham's Servant to Ur?
Question B: Was Player B justified in blocking?

EmJayBee83 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 14, 2015, 12:36:04 AM »

Quote from: Westy on January 14, 2015, 12:26:59 AM

Question A: Do you play Abraham's Servant to Ur?

Yes. Getting to 4 should be your goal so you get a clear 2nd in the event Player B cannot stop Player C. After all it is not Like Emperor Claudius can be counted on to stop (even mediocre) OT heroes.

Quote

Question B: Was Player B justified in blocking?

Yes. It is not like Emperor Claudius can be counted on to stop (even mediocre) OT heroes.

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #2 on:** January 14, 2015, 12:38:45 AM »

Made a few tweaks.

EmJayBee83 · « **Reply #3 on:** January 14, 2015, 12:45:34 AM »

After tweaks I would stick with yes and yes.

Player B should only block you if he has another block he can pull out against player C in the event you somehow kill Claudius. You should assume that Player B is playing rationally (i.e., that he has another block for C), so you should take the LS if you can.

The Guardian · « **Reply #4 on:** January 14, 2015, 04:06:22 AM »

If Player C is Justin Alstad, you definitely defeat Claudius to get your 4th because you can reasonably assume that Justin isn't going to be stopped by Claudius.

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #5 on:** January 14, 2015, 09:53:18 AM »

You always have to win the soul. You can't afford to lose another turn where people will have to block.

I think the block depends on hand composition. If I had a different combo I was planning on using to block the other player that I felt is more foolproof (like Black character and Babel), maybe that's fine. He could also be blocking to ensure he is second, even in a tie.

LukeChips · « **Reply #6 on:** January 14, 2015, 10:33:21 AM »

Did player B have any battle-winners in his hand?

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #7 on:** January 14, 2015, 12:35:52 PM »

Quote from: LukeChips on January 14, 2015, 10:33:21 AM

Did player B have any battle-winners in his hand?

Unknown, you're Player A.

LukeChips · « **Reply #8 on:** January 14, 2015, 12:42:48 PM »

Quote from: Westy on January 14, 2015, 12:35:52 PM

Quote from: LukeChips on January 14, 2015, 10:33:21 AM
Did player B have any battle-winners in his hand?
Unknown, you're Player A.

He probably did with 8 cards in his hand.

EmJayBee83 · « **Reply #9 on:** January 14, 2015, 12:49:44 PM »

Quote from: The Guardian on January 14, 2015, 04:06:22 AM

If Player C is Justin Alstad, you definitely defeat Claudius to get your 4th because you can reasonably assume that Justin isn't going to be stopped by Claudius.

If Player D is Justin Alstad, you immediately play the Falling Away you were lucky enough to pull from your Women pack on him.

Redoubter · « **Reply #10 on:** January 14, 2015, 03:06:50 PM »

First, Player B should definitely block if they have a shot at blocking both, since they are tied for second currently and would lose that going by not blocking. By blocking and with a successful rescue, they have sole possession of second. They should also be working to actually win the game, which they go a long way towards by keeping someone at 3 and getting to 4. A beefcake wins a lot of battles on his own, no fault in making that block.

Player A needs to play Servant, probably, but that's up to them. B has 10 cards to block C with, and A needs to win souls to keep pace.

There's just too much going on in a Booster game to assume anything that late in the game, and everyone has to play for themselves to win, not another player to lose. Get whatever points you can from the table.

LukeChips · « **Reply #11 on:** January 14, 2015, 03:12:30 PM »

Has anyone played (and who) got and played SoG/NJ?

Redoubter · « **Reply #12 on:** January 14, 2015, 03:26:24 PM »

Quote from: LukeChips on January 14, 2015, 03:12:30 PM

Has anyone played (and who) got and played SoG/NJ?

This is Booster draft (even if the title doesn't indicate it), so the odds of getting a SoG are fairly low (as in almost non-existent) for the tournament.

LukeChips · « **Reply #13 on:** January 14, 2015, 03:39:43 PM »

Oh, I forgot about that, sorry.

The Guardian · « **Reply #14 on:** January 14, 2015, 04:20:15 PM »

Quote from: EmJayBee83 on January 14, 2015, 12:49:44 PM

Quote from: The Guardian on January 14, 2015, 04:06:22 AM
If Player C is Justin Alstad, you definitely defeat Claudius to get your 4th because you can reasonably assume that Justin isn't going to be stopped by Claudius.
If Player D is Justin Alstad, you immediately play the Falling Away you were lucky enough to pull from your Women pack on him.

*UPDATED*

12 upvotes in this entire thread and 9 of them are for this post...

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #15 on:** January 14, 2015, 11:43:26 PM »

I was Player B in this situation. I was pressing my advantage because an easy block here would mean that I might be able to get into a solid second place should I be able to rescue, and then being one block away from winning the game. Now, I had absolutely no back up, though I was hoping to draw into something, and didn't have any gold enhancements anyway.

So this is why I wish I could table talk. Had I been able to table talk, I would have answered the "WHY ARE YOU BLOCKING?!" "YOU BETTER HAVE ANOTHER BLOCK IN HAND" with resounding "I don'ts." to further press my advantage. Whether he would have believed me or not remains to be seen, and that's the fun of multiplayer and table talk. The game is getting into your opponent's head.

In the end, I didn't draw anything, and Player C had the rescue anyway, but I knew when I made that play that it was counter to standard Redemption procedure and thought it was an interesting situation with no necessarily correct answer.

JSB23 · « **Reply #16 on:** January 15, 2015, 02:03:11 AM »

Quote from: EmJayBee83 on January 14, 2015, 12:49:44 PM

If Player D is Justin Alstad, you immediately play the Falling Away you were lucky enough to pull from your Women pack on him.

Justin can't get to 5 if you never let him get to 1.

The Guardian · « **Reply #17 on:** January 15, 2015, 05:15:31 AM »

Quote from: EmJayBee83 on January 14, 2015, 12:49:44 PM

Quote from: The Guardian on January 14, 2015, 04:06:22 AM
If Player C is Justin Alstad, you definitely defeat Claudius to get your 4th because you can reasonably assume that Justin isn't going to be stopped by Claudius.
If Player D is Justin Alstad, you immediately play the Falling Away you were lucky enough to pull from your Women pack on him.

I'm keeping track of everyone who upvoted that post. There will be no mercy for any of you, in any category we may end up playing in...

Redoubter · « **Reply #18 on:** January 15, 2015, 07:49:51 AM »

Quote from: Westy on January 14, 2015, 11:43:26 PM

In the end, I didn't draw anything, and Player C had the rescue anyway, but I knew when I made that play that it was counter to standard Redemption procedure and thought it was an interesting situation with no necessarily correct answer.

I agree there is no correct answer, but I definitely agree with you that it was the best play for you to try and win.

Now, would I have been on you had I been A? Of course

But we each need to win the game for ourselves and it doesn't matter if someone else loses because we took the option that left us a better chance to win.

LukeChips · « **Reply #19 on:** January 15, 2015, 09:33:20 AM »

I would have definitely blocked, player A may not have had anything good.

The Guardian · « **Reply #20 on:** January 15, 2015, 02:28:03 PM »

I think the only reason I wouldn't block a NT Hero with Claudius (in Player B's position) was if I had more Gold defense left in my deck and I had a reasonably chance to draw some on my turn in an effort to stop Player C.

If I know that Player C has OT options available and my Claudius is just stand-alone, then I might as well block Player A and attempt to take sole possession of second place on my turn.

LukeChips · « **Reply #21 on:** January 15, 2015, 02:34:39 PM »

Quote from: The Guardian on January 15, 2015, 02:28:03 PM

I think the only reason I wouldn't block a NT Hero with Claudius (in Player B's position) was if I had more Gold defense left in my deck and I had a reasonably chance to draw some on my turn in an effort to stop Player C.

Oh, so this is Apostles Claudius! I thought that it was TEC!

Chris · « **Reply #22 on:** January 17, 2015, 03:47:10 PM »

Assuming we're in an all or nothing situation, I would say that yes, you do have to play Servant here. Even though you may be eliminating Player B's best block, you need to focus on your own rescues as you're very unlikely to make it through two more full rounds.

I don't think Player B is justified in blocking unless they have some way of knowing that they cannot stop Player C regardless or you have a better block saved. Fourth place doesn't mean anything, so you should be attempting to win. By potentially using up your best block (or at the very least, showing it to Player C so he can plan for it), you are reducing your chances of winning.

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #23 on:** January 17, 2015, 04:32:40 PM »

Quote from: Chris on January 17, 2015, 03:47:10 PM

Assuming we're in an all or nothing situation, I would say that yes, you do have to play Servant here. Even though you may be eliminating Player B's best block, you need to focus on your own rescues as you're very unlikely to make it through two more full rounds.

I don't think Player B is justified in blocking unless they have some way of knowing that they cannot stop Player C regardless or you have a better block saved. Fourth place doesn't mean anything, so you should be attempting to win. By potentially using up your best block (or at the very least, showing it to Player C so he can plan for it), you are reducing your chances of winning.

By the same logic, Player A is reducing their chances of winning by rescueing the soul because you are hindering the very person that you're depending on.

Nameless · « **Reply #24 on:** January 17, 2015, 06:13:18 PM »

Quote from: Westy on January 17, 2015, 04:32:40 PM

Quote from: Chris on January 17, 2015, 03:47:10 PM
Assuming we're in an all or nothing situation, I would say that yes, you do have to play Servant here. Even though you may be eliminating Player B's best block, you need to focus on your own rescues as you're very unlikely to make it through two more full rounds.

I don't think Player B is justified in blocking unless they have some way of knowing that they cannot stop Player C regardless or you have a better block saved. Fourth place doesn't mean anything, so you should be attempting to win. By potentially using up your best block (or at the very least, showing it to Player C so he can plan for it), you are reducing your chances of winning.
By the same logic, Player A is reducing their chances of winning by rescueing the soul because you are hindering the very person that you're depending on.

That is because the player he was attacking was nub headed enough to block him instead of saving his block.

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Author Topic: Multiplayer Situation (Read 4731 times)

Warrior_Monk

Warrior_Monk

LukeChips

Warrior_Monk

LukeChips

LukeChips

LukeChips

Warrior_Monk

LukeChips

LukeChips

Chris

Warrior_Monk