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Can man defy what God has ordained? If so, God is not God.

The only way you can "defy what he has ordained" is if you know what that is. Do you know what God has ordained? No, so how do you know if you're defying it? You can't. You see, people can make choices even when God already knows what they will choose.

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Tell me if it is okay to steal or murder?

Completely non-sequitor

I was heading somewhere, but I guess you just like ignoring people better.

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In point of fact you have made claims.

I have made no claims, I have merely declined to accept your claims.

In which you are implying (claiming) that our claims are false.

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You cannot prove that it isn't credible.

I showed you the example of the mistranslation, the two seperate creation accounts in Genesis also comes to mind.

What are you talking about? I didn't see that.

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The difference is that there is more evidence supporting my choice than yours.

Oh really? You haven't shown me any.

Have you ever read the Bible? If you haven't, you should definitely do so before you claim that it is false. If you have, then you would certainly know some of the predictions made in it that have come true. - Just see Revelation.

Quote from: Colin Michael on February 01, 2009, 12:15:18 AM

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And yet you cannot prove that the Bible isn't the word of God. 

Prove beyond a shadow of a doubt? No. But have you given any evidence?

Ok, I'm glad we agree on that.  You can't prove that the Bible isn't God's Word 100%, and I can't prove that it is 100%.  So both of us are "choosing" to believe our perspective based on some amount of "faith".

That is some bad relativism. Your lack of evidence is my evidence. I am going to change my claim to this: there is no evidence to say that the Bible is the word of God.

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You cannot prove that it isn't credible. 

I showed you the example of the mistranslation, the two seperate creation accounts in Genesis also comes to mind.

You showed me something you think is a mistranslation, and I showed you that there is no evidence that it is false that we are a little lower than the angels.  You proved nothing.  Your point about Genesis, and probably 20 other similar stereotypical examples of "where the Bible contradicts itself" are as easily explained and understood.
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Elohim means God, you know that.

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You choose to believe that, just as I choose to believe that it is credible and that it is the Word of God.

The burden of proof, however, is on you as you are attempting to prove the credibility of the Bible.

Wrong.  This is a Christian forum.  It is assumed that the Bible is true here.  If you believe differently, then the burden is on you.
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So this is a facist regime? I have my proof. There is no evidence to support your claim of credibility.

You don't know my lifestyle; you think I'm going down a path to meth.

Actually, I know a decent amount about your lifestyle after reading your posts for the last year or more.  If it weren't for the great purge, I could go back and quote quite a bit.  And I am much less convinced that you are on a path to meth, than I am convinced that you are on a path away from Christianity.
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Just because I have a beer now and then, hate the government, have a smoke now and then, and take the prescribed medicine my doctor gives me doesn't mean I'm living a "lifestyle of sin" and heading down some kind of path to becoming the next Sid Vicious.

Quote from: Colin Michael on February 01, 2009, 12:39:05 AM

Your lack of evidence is my evidence. I am going to change my claim to this: there is no evidence to say that the Bible is the word of God.

For a person who claims to not make any claims, you keep making claims

Nice way to side-step that one.

Elohim means God, you know that.

Elohim "typically" means God, and you know that.  In fact I can quote you

...the word Elohim (which typically means God...

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It's typically translated God. The word means God.

Quote from: Colin Michael on February 01, 2009, 12:15:18 AM

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You choose to believe that, just as I choose to believe that it is credible and that it is the Word of God.

The burden of proof, however, is on you as you are attempting to prove the credibility of the Bible.

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Wrong.  This is a Christian forum.  It is assumed that the Bible is true here.  If you believe differently, then the burden is on you.

So this is a facist regime? I have my proof. There is no evidence to support your claim of credibility.

No amazingly, being a Christian forum does not necessarily mean being a facist forum   And your wordplay is silly.  You are still claiming that the Bible which is believed to be credible by almost everyone on this forum is not credible.  You need something better to back that up than the fact that I can't prove that it is credible 100%.  You can't prove anything 100% and don't even believe the chair you are sitting on is actually real.  So my lack of 100% proof doesn't really give you any support at all.
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I'm asking for evidence, not proof positive. Bandwagons mean nothing to me.

Just because I have a beer now and then, hate the government, have a smoke now and then, and take the prescribed medicine my doctor gives me doesn't mean I'm living a "lifestyle of sin" and heading down some kind of path to becoming the next Sid Vicious.

The fact that you compare yourself to being better than Sid Vicious instead of comparing yourself to being Christlike is just one small part of why you are on the path away from Christianity.
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Okay, Christ drank and upset authorities. He actually provided alchohol at parties.

You are still claiming that the Bible is credible (when you say that there is no evidence that it is credible).

We are not debating credibility we are debating whether it is the word of God or the word of man.

That is not what you said first, and it is obviously not always correct.

Why?

And several people have given some.  Someone has suggested a book that is full of evidence.  The evidence is there, you're just not looking.

There's been no evidence given as of yet, if I'm wrong please correct me.

This whole conversation about Jesus drinking vs. modern American Christians drinking has already been run into the ground.  If you haven't figured out any difference by now, then it's hopeless to repeat it all.

Good, I won't want to give us more rabbit trails to go on.

Stop arguing trivial things and get to the point. What is your evidence to support your claim that the Bible is the "word of God?"

Quote from: Colin Michael on February 01, 2009, 01:27:36 AM

We are not debating credibility we are debating whether it is the word of God or the word of man...There's been no evidence given as of yet, if I'm wrong please correct me.

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 11:42:07 PM

How about the fact that every prediction it has made so far has come true. You will never be able to find a single passage in the scripture that can be proven false.

Quote from: metalpsalm on January 31, 2009, 06:14:26 AM

Have you read Evidence that Demands a Verdict ~ Josh McDowel? I don't think you could read that and maintain your position and be intellectually honest

Quote from: Prof Underwood on January 30, 2009, 05:35:06 PM

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 30, 2009, 05:20:51 PM

I was more asking for any kind of defense of the Bible being, not only infallible, but incorruptible.

I've told you this before.  My belief that the Bible has not been corrupted is based on the character of the Author.

God gave the Bible to people so that they could get to know him.  God is powerful enough and smart enough to figure out a way to keep the Bible accurate despite the natural tendency of copying and translating to mess things up.  And He loves us enough and wants us to be able to know Him enough to do what was necessary.

And in addition to all of this which has already been written, let me add that one can learn about God's essential qualities purely by studying the world around us that He created.  And the Bible is the only book which claims to contain the truth about god, and which describes a god who actually matches up with the God that we would expect based on nature.

So that is supposed to prove your argument?

I'm not exactly sure what Colin's looking for, but this site may contain some evidence.

I'm currently reading Modern Competitive Strategy by Gordon Walker and the Redemption Message Board by Stephen Schaefer.

Furthermore, I originally assumed this thread had erupted into controversy when AngelCrusader777 stated that he read the entire Twilight series on page three. Even though it's for girls, Doug Gray needs to review it. If he thought Harry Potter was bad, Twilight will surely blow his brains against the ceiling.

Oh, and according to Godwin's Law, this thread should have ended when Fireninja brought up the holocaust in reference to Adderall.

Redemption Message Board was a collection of writers, headed by Stephen Schaefer. He was kinda the editor and added quite a few things too...

Twilight. I missed that. My friends and I make fun of Edward Cullen... if only I could do impressions online.

My Basis has for Biblical truth won't prove it absolutely (because nothing can).

The way I see it, there is a God. That has been porven to me in Science. Evolution is horribly false in my eyes from scientific evidence, and this has propelled me into the Intelligent Design theory, out of which I tossed out teh alien element, because, that's ridiculous. I then am left with a designer God. I choose to believe the Christian God is true after studies of most major relgions (based on a view that if a relgion is true it will last). To me, the Bible is simply the most logical thing to believe. I won't go out and say it's infallible (because as has been menitoned that term stems from the 1800s, so it's pretty new). However, I do believe it's inspired, so, any mistkaes that are there are supposed to be there. Yeah, illogical, I know.

At this point, I'm just going to have to drop my inquiries and respect your views. It's easy to get caught up in the heat of debate and therefore I'd like to apologise to any of my brothers in Christ who may feel alienated. Whether one believes the Bible to be the work of men pointing to God or the words of God himself imparted to man, we are still united in one thing: faith in our Father and Jesus Christ whom he has sent. God himself is in control of all things; all of us were knit together by him before the dawn of time. Everyone has their journey they have to walk and everyone has been imparted as much truth as they need to complete that journey, for in all actuality, it is not their journey, but God's journey. All the glory to him.

I'm not exactly sure why you put this response in a different thread.  But I commend it nonetheless.  You are indeed correct that all Christians are united in our faith that He sent Jesus to die for us, is in control of all things, and knows us each completely (as well as many other uniting beliefs).  I truly hope and pray that the journey of faith in your life and mine will always keep us united in these things, and that someday we will both be praising God together in Heaven for eternity.

Colin has already conceded this debate FN.  I think we should just leave it that way.

Colin has already conceded this debate FN.

FN? I have never seen that abbreviation before.

Oooooooooooooooooh....