Author Topic: What are you reading? (A quick poll.) (Read 107291 times)

lightningninja · « **Reply #175 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:32:55 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 06:20:28 PM

What makes you draw the conclusion "I'm living for this world?"

mainly the entire paragraph of text above that comment.

You don't need faith, rules, or morals if God is completely sovereign and everything is predestined.

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Also, what makes you think that just because men wrote the Bible I'm throwing out all the Bible's teachings? Christianity survived for 1500 years without the Bible as its infallible standard, why can't I?

The fact that you said, "frankly, I don't find the Bible to be credible." That was my first clue. My second was that a smart person like you who wants to figure out everything for himself, instead of just going with fixed doctrines, would not trust something that he doesnt' find credible. It just doesn't add up. Who says that the Bible was not the standard for people? Christians have always believed the Bible, and that's the standard. It tells us how we should behave.

Here's some things to consider. If the Bible isn't true, then why does our non-Christian society still accept a date(2009), set when Jesus was born, if they don't even believe that Jesus ever was born?

Why do we still celebrate Christmas(I know that's it's not actually when Christ was born) if God was never born in the first place?

The answer is that these things did happen. If the Bible isn't true it's one heck of a fairy tale. And if the Bible isn't true, and these event didn't happen, dates and other events wouldn't have been celebrated for 2009 years. It happened, and that's why people accept the Bible and the holidays I mentioned.

Colin Michael · « **Reply #176 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:37:14 PM »

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mainly the entire paragraph of text above that comment. Smiley You don't need faith, rules, or morals if God is completely sovereign and everything is predestined.

Faith= amor fati (love thy fate).
Rules and morals come through social contract theory.

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The fact that you said, "frankly, I don't find the Bible to be credible." That was my first clue. My second was that a smart person like you who wants to figure out everything for himself, instead of just going with fixed doctrines, would not trust something that he doesnt' find credible. It just doesn't add up. Who says that the Bible was not the standard for people? Christians have always believed the Bible, and that's the standard. It tells us how we should behave.

Here's some things to consider. If the Bible isn't true, then why does our non-Christian society still accept a date(2009), set when Jesus was born, if they don't even believe that Jesus ever was born?

Why do we still celebrate Christmas(I know that's it's not actually when Christ was born) if God was never born in the first place?

The answer is that these things did happen. If the Bible isn't true it's one heck of a fairy tale. And if the Bible isn't true, and these event didn't happen, dates and other events wouldn't have been celebrated for 2009 years. It happened, and that's why people accept the Bible and the holidays I mentioned.

You're still excluding the middle and that's quite a big slippery slope.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #177 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:42:29 PM »

Every concept of everything associated with Christianity came from the Bible - everything. The Apostles' Creed was based solely from things learned from nothing other than the Bible. If it weren't for the Bible, there would be no Christians, because no one would know any of the lessons taught in it. Think long and hard - if it weren't for the Bible would you - or anyone else for that matter - know about God?

Colin Michael · « **Reply #178 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:43:49 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 06:42:29 PM

Every concept of everything associated with Christianity came from the Bible - everything. The Apostles' Creed was based solely from things learned from nothing other than the Bible. If it weren't for the Bible, there would be no Christians, because no one would know any of the lessons taught in it. Think long and hard - if it weren't for the Bible would you - or anyone else for that matter - know about God?

Insufficient ethos for making that kind of argument.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #179 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:46:41 PM »

To me, this can be translated as, "Oh, you're stupid."

Colin Michael · « **Reply #180 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:48:22 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 06:46:41 PM

To me, this can be translated as, "Oh, you're stupid."

No, you don't qualify as an expert on early Christian history. You need to provide sources to back your claim if you wish to make such a claim.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #181 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:50:48 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 06:48:22 PM

No, you don't qualify as an expert on early Christian history.

Oh, really? And all this time...

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You need to provide sources to back your claim if you wish to make such a claim.

What are your sources for any of your claims?

Warrior_Monk · « **Reply #182 on:** January 31, 2009, 06:55:17 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 06:50:48 PM

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You need to provide sources to back your claim if you wish to make such a claim.
What are your sources for any of your claims?

skeptisism

Colin Michael · « **Reply #183 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:02:38 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 06:50:48 PM

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 06:48:22 PM
No, you don't qualify as an expert on early Christian history.
Oh, really? And all this time...

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You need to provide sources to back your claim if you wish to make such a claim.
What are your sources for any of your claims?

I don't need a source, you're the one making claims.

EmJayBee83 · « **Reply #184 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:15:02 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 06:42:29 PM

Think long and hard - if it weren't for the Bible would you - or anyone else for that matter - know about God?

Yes, precisely because the primary revelation of the Creator is not Scripture but creation.

Quote from: Romans 1:18-20

The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.

If you are saying that you can only come to know God through the Bible, you are in essence denying either God's righteousness or His justice. After all how could a just God wipe out the whole world for their iniquities (Noah, ark, etc.) if there was no Bible around to let them know they had sinned.

lightningninja · « **Reply #185 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:43:01 PM »

Tequnically, you don't NEED the Bible to be saved. But saying that the Bible has not merit is completely disregarding God's purspose for his Bible. It doesn't matter who wrote it, it's true and it illustrates God's plan for our lives.

Red · « **Reply #186 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:44:40 PM »

i agree with fninja and if you don't beleve it you ain't goin in the right way

Colin Michael · « **Reply #187 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:50:57 PM »

Quote from: fireninja on January 31, 2009, 07:43:01 PM

Tequnically, you don't NEED the Bible to be saved. But saying that the Bible has not merit is completely disregarding God's purspose for his Bible. It doesn't matter who wrote it, it's true and it illustrates God's plan for our lives.

Alright, that was my original point.

lightningninja · « **Reply #188 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:55:05 PM »

Great. Then we are on the same page on that.

Red · « **Reply #189 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:57:21 PM »

back to books please

Colin Michael · « **Reply #190 on:** January 31, 2009, 07:57:35 PM »

Quote from: fireninja on January 31, 2009, 07:55:05 PM

Great. Then we are on the same page on that.

One may reach salvation without the Bible and there are many works in addition to the 73 that truth may be found in. However, the Bible is the most credible source as to finding out information on who Jesus was.

Quote from: RED on January 31, 2009, 07:57:21 PM

back to books please

Ironically, after Nietzsche I'm probably going to take a run through Proverbs and Wisdom, then hit up the N.T.

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #191 on:** January 31, 2009, 08:27:27 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 03:42:51 PM

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 30, 2009, 05:43:26 PM
Being limitless is hardly a bad thing.
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Humans without limits is most certainly a bad thing. Assuming that you aren't just messing with me here with such a ludicrous statement, your attitude reminds me much of Adam and Eve in the Garden. They wanted to be just like God and didn't want to have limits. Look where that got them (and us).
Limits halt progress.

This is just dumb. I am going to assume that you are smart enough to not actually believe that mankind would be better off if there were never any limits on them. I am therefore going to assume that you are just trying to be funny or annoying or something, and not follow this rabbit trail any further.

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #192 on:** January 31, 2009, 08:28:42 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 03:51:25 PM

If your false hypothetical was true, yes I would take speed to help me on a paper. I don't care about legality or the ridiculous dogmas of the "holiness movement." I do, however, care about the damage to my brain, the loss of control, and hallucinations speed causes. If those did not exist and it just made me think faster (which is what Adderoll is in the first place: speed without the bad stuff), I would totally take speed. In other words, that's a ridiculous false hypothetical.

So the only reason you don't take any drug is because you personally have decided that the negative side effects outweigh the benefits. And you don't care that your example could lead to destroying someone else's life because they follow your philosophy and have different levels of knowledge about negative side effects.

Colin Michael · « **Reply #193 on:** January 31, 2009, 08:31:47 PM »

Quote from: Prof Underwood on January 31, 2009, 08:28:42 PM

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 03:51:25 PM
If your false hypothetical was true, yes I would take speed to help me on a paper. I don't care about legality or the ridiculous dogmas of the "holiness movement." I do, however, care about the damage to my brain, the loss of control, and hallucinations speed causes. If those did not exist and it just made me think faster (which is what Adderoll is in the first place: speed without the bad stuff), I would totally take speed. In other words, that's a ridiculous false hypothetical.
So the only reason you don't take any drug is because you personally have decided that the negative side effects outweigh the benefits. And you don't care that your example could lead to destroying someone else's life because they follow your philosophy and have different levels of knowledge about negative side effects.

Well, obviously anyone who knows me knows I don't I'm not doing speed.

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #194 on:** January 31, 2009, 11:12:15 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 08:31:47 PM

Well, obviously anyone who knows me knows I don't I'm not doing speed.

Actually, it is possible that someone could see you popping pills and not know what they are. And it is also possible that someone who knows that you WOULD do speed if it wasn't going to hurt you. And it is possible that they might not believe that speed would hurt them (many people deny the dangers of drugs), and therefore start doing it. It is also possible that Adderoll has some more harmful side effects than you are aware of.

I'm just saying that taking any drug on a regular basis that is only necessary due to lifestyle choices (such as not getting enough sleep, or procrastination) is a dangerous thing for yourself and those around you.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #195 on:** January 31, 2009, 11:19:04 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 07:02:38 PM

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You need to provide sources to back your claim if you wish to make such a claim.
What are your sources for any of your claims?
I don't need a source, you're the one making claims.

What about "The Bible is false," or "It's okay to do drugs," or "Satan is weak," or "You should disobey government," or "People are predestined to be saved?" What's your backup on any of those?

Colin Michael · « **Reply #196 on:** January 31, 2009, 11:31:51 PM »

Quote from: Prof Underwood on January 31, 2009, 11:12:15 PM

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 08:31:47 PM
Well, obviously anyone who knows me knows I don't I'm not doing speed.
Actually, it is possible that someone could see you popping pills and not know what they are. And it is also possible that someone who knows that you WOULD do speed if it wasn't going to hurt you. And it is possible that they might not believe that speed would hurt them (many people deny the dangers of drugs), and therefore start doing it. It is also possible that Adderoll has some more harmful side effects than you are aware of.

I'm just saying that taking any drug on a regular basis that is only necessary due to lifestyle choices (such as not getting enough sleep, or procrastination) is a dangerous thing for yourself and those around you.

I take it every day as prescribed by my doctor and it has nothing to do with lifestyle choices. As for your "slippery slope" I'm not even going to bother.

Quote from: BubbleBoy on January 31, 2009, 11:19:04 PM

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 07:02:38 PM
Quote
Quote
You need to provide sources to back your claim if you wish to make such a claim.
What are your sources for any of your claims?
I don't need a source, you're the one making claims.
What about "The Bible is false," or "It's okay to do drugs," or "Satan is weak," or "You should disobey government," or "People are predestined to be saved?" What's your backup on any of those?

First of all, I didn't say the Bible was false, I just I didn't believe it to be the word of God and you cannot provide any evidence to support your claim that it is.
I never said it was okay to do drugs.
Satan is weak. Prove me wrong.
Tell me why you should obey your government.
Your own Bible could give the answers to the predestination question. The logical answer is simply, if there is free-will, there is no God. If man has the freedom to deny God his Godship, then man is God. I need no outside sources, I'm using an appeal to reason.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #197 on:** January 31, 2009, 11:42:07 PM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 11:31:51 PM

Tell me why you should obey your government.

Tell me if it is okay to steal or murder?

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 11:31:51 PM

First of all, I didn't say the Bible was false, I just I didn't believe it to be the word of God and you cannot provide any evidence to support your claim that it is.

How about the fact that every prediction it has made so far has come true. You will never be able to find a single passage in the scripture that can be proven false.

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 11:31:51 PM

Your own Bible could give the answers to the predestination question. The logical answer is simply, if there is free-will, there is no God. If man has the freedom to deny God his Godship, then man is God. I need no outside sources, I'm using an appeal to reason.

Are you saying that people do not have free will?

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 11:31:51 PM

Satan is weak. Prove me wrong.

Okay then, why don't you go beat him up for me?

Colin Michael · « **Reply #198 on:** January 31, 2009, 11:46:40 PM »

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Tell me if it is okay to steal or murder?

Completely non-sequitor

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How about the fact that every prediction it has made so far has come true. You will never be able to find a single passage in the scripture that can be proven false.

Didn't you just say I wasn't providing sources?

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Are you saying that people do not have free will?

Can man defy what God has ordained? If so, God is not God.

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Okay then, why don't you go beat him up for me?

Sure, where's he at?

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #199 on:** February 01, 2009, 12:05:19 AM »

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 11:31:51 PM

First of all, I didn't say the Bible was false

Oh really?

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 30, 2009, 05:43:26 PM

I don't view the Bible as a credible source, actually.

Quote from: Colin Michael on January 31, 2009, 04:29:03 PM

I will prove the Bible wrong right now.

In point of fact you have made claims. And yet you cannot prove that the Bible isn't the word of God. You cannot prove that it isn't credible. You choose to believe that, just as I choose to believe that it is credible and that it is the Word of God. The difference is that there is more evidence supporting my choice than yours. But realistically it doesn't really matter to you. In spite of what you write, I don't believe that your beliefs are based on evidence. Your beliefs all seem to coincidentally line up with the lifestyle that you want to live, rather than you making your lifestyle line up with the beliefs that you should have.

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Author Topic: What are you reading? (A quick poll.) (Read 107291 times)

Warrior_Monk