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Community-driven efforts will fail within this community.

So start a foundation.

Community-driven efforts will fail within this community.

That is a generalization, and is inaccurate.  A more accurate statement would be that for community-driven efforts to succeed, there has to be either mass acceptance or a single person who is willing to consistently put in time on something until it is finished.  I will limit my examples to ones that I have personally been involved in (leaving out things like the chess feature, and the thumbs up feature that the community lobbied successfully for):

I remember when someone first introduced Hamachi to us on the forum, and after checking it out it seemed like a great idea.  I have helped maintain some of the most used Hamachi groups (primarily for ROOT).

Speaking of ROOT, I was involved in helping get the approval to make that an official RNRS category, filling the void that had been left by Jacob's Ladder (another community driven idea that was successful for a while) shutting down.

Speaking of official categories, I was involved in helping TEAMS become an official RNRS category as well.  I organized and ran it as a side tournament at Nats '08, and kept working on it from there.

I also noticed a need on the forum for a better organized way to find and record trading references.  So Soul Seeker and I both started ways to do that within the Market sub board.

There was also desire on the forum for there to be a Redemption Hall of Fame.  So I put together a team and we started that as a way to show how the best of the Redemption community gives glory to God, and also as a way to remember those from long ago, who many people today would never know about.

And for those of you who see "Elder" under my name and think..."well sure he could do those things, he's a PTB", I did all of those things BEFORE becoming and "Elder".  And for that matter, the whole "Elder" system was also a recent community-driven change.

Finally, this:

Quote from: SomeKittens on December 10, 2010, 04:12:41 PM

Community-driven efforts will fail within this community.  Unless said efforts are arguing and telling other people how wrong they are for having an opinion.

has nothing to do with this thread.

I disagree.   

Underwood, those are some inspiring stories.  Problem is, that's one person working really hard to do something, and not "Community-driven" like a wiki would be.

Actually most of the things that I talked about were group efforts.

Someone else found Hamachi and told the community here about it.  And it wouldn't be the standard except that is was widely accepted and everyone started downloading it and joining groups.

Sure I got ROOT to be an official category, but Soul Seeker was the one who came up with the Substitute Online Tournament, on which it was based.  And it wouldn't have had a chance if it also hadn't been widely accepted by the community and a bunch of people hadn't decided to play in it.

Sure I helped make TEAMS official, but it wouldn't have had a chance if it hadn't been one of the most popular events at Nats that year, and if Mike Wolfe hadn't picked up the baton to run it as a side tournament again at the next year's Nats (which I couldn't go to).

Sure Soul Seeker and I started the organized way of leaving and looking for trade references, but it wouldn't be helpful at all if all of the rest of the people in the community weren't putting their experiences with people there.

And the Hall of Fame wouldn't work if there weren't a committee of people from around the country helping to organize it, and all of the people in the community making their nominations or casting their votes.

And the "Elder" system came about due to a groundswell of the overall community begging to have something put in place that would help them to get faster rulings, etc.

All of these things really are COMMUNITY efforts.  And I for one am grateful for this community, and proud to be a part of it.

SomeKittens: RTS stinks compared to similar programs.
Alex: It's all there is, so without compitition, hard to say it stinks compared to other programs.
SomeKittens: There is that program for Magic.
Schaef: Bad example.
SomeKittens: Actually, you can import Redemption Cards into, someone just needs to do it.
Alex: Why don't you do it then?
SomeKittens: I'd rather go big.
Alex: So why not do that to hold it over til you can go big?
SomeKittens: When did I say I had anything to hold us over?

That how I read what you said. You presented Magic's program as a possible alternative and don't seem willing to put in the work, so thus I will not consider it, as I am perfectly happy for RTS.

And actually, the Magic Workstation has only a fraction of the functionality of RTS.  It only provides basic card game functionality, drawing and shuffling and such, kind of like VASSAL does basic board game functions and you can "import" games into it.  So it's more than importing the cards, if you want it to have Redemption-specific functionality, you'd also have to design and add in settings and scripting to accommodate it.

And oh yes, the full version costs about $27.

We should rename this thread "Somekittens VS  The world".

Was that really necessary?

Thank you everyone for your responses. The first three and a half pages or so were somewhat helpful. Hopefully whatever happens, the future of ROOT can accommodate more people.