Author Topic: Inception (Potential Spoilers) (Read 18804 times)

JSB23 · « **Reply #50 on:** August 05, 2010, 09:36:15 PM »

I was asking Ironica

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #51 on:** August 05, 2010, 10:50:45 PM »

Quote from: JSB23 on August 05, 2010, 02:09:28 PM

Too all who have seen Inception:
Is this true?
Do any characters (other than that one) commit suicide?
Does the movie actually encourage suicide?
Or does it show suicide as a horrible thing that ruins lives?
I've wrestled with severe depression and suicidal thoughts for years and I saw nothing that encourages suicide in the movie

1. Yes, it could be seen as trivializing suicide since the entire plot is predacated on the theory that nothing is truly real. If nothing is real, suicide is fine. So, the review has a somewhat valid point.

2. It would depend on what you define as encourage.

3. Yes, but it also seems to suggest that the suicide in question may have been a dream and therefore not real.

JSB23 · « **Reply #52 on:** August 05, 2010, 11:14:14 PM »

where did you get the "nothing is real concept"?

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #53 on:** August 05, 2010, 11:31:55 PM »

Quote from: JSB23 on August 05, 2010, 11:14:14 PM

where did you get the "nothing is real concept"?

Did you even see the movie? The entire movie is predicated the idea that we do not know what reality is, that reality is whatever we want it to be, and by extension, the only things that are real to us are things we accept as real. Essentially, if your "real" is commiting suicide, than that is your reality.

That is why the top is not shown falling at the end of the movie - ultimately it does not matter if Cobb is in "actual" reality or not - he has accepted wherever he is as his reality and has found internal peace and the ability to again be with his children.

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #54 on:** August 05, 2010, 11:41:28 PM »

I just saw Inception today. It was just as good as expected, probably the best movie since The Dark Knight. I thought that I would have trouble following, as I usually do with psychological movies, but I actually did just fine. I could pretty easily keep track of what was going on at all times. But this is a movie you can easliy watch twice and still extract a lot of depth from.

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #55 on:** August 05, 2010, 11:45:53 PM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on August 05, 2010, 11:41:28 PM

I just saw Inception today. It was just as good as expected, probably the best movie since The Dark Knight. I thought that I would have trouble following, as I usually do with psychological movies, but I actually did just fine. I could pretty easily keep track of what was going on at all times. But this is a movie you can easliy watch twice and still extract a lot of depth from.

I have to ask then - was it all a dream or was reality shown at all during the movie?

BubbleBoy · « **Reply #56 on:** August 05, 2010, 11:55:36 PM »

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on August 05, 2010, 11:45:53 PM

was it all a dream or was reality shown at all during the movie?

The end leaves you guessing, but I'd like to say reality was shown.

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #57 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:02:20 AM »

Quote from: BubbleBoy on August 05, 2010, 11:55:36 PM

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on August 05, 2010, 11:45:53 PM
was it all a dream or was reality shown at all during the movie?
The end leaves you guessing, but I'd like to say reality was shown.

When why did his kids look the same as he had remembered, many years prior >:c.

Same clothes and everything >:c.

>:c

Mr.Hiatus · « **Reply #58 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:03:52 AM »

I think this whole discussion is not valid due to the movie being able to be perceived in so many different views.

Ironica · « **Reply #59 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:24:47 AM »

Quote from: Mr.Hiatus on August 05, 2010, 09:34:39 PM

Quote
Did you happen to read the entire review or just what was posted? If you haven't read the whole thing, then you can't really judge it.
Of course I only read what was posted because that was the point of the conversation at the time, and what was being argued. It was just part of the review that he posted, and I only commented on that part. So why would I go read a whole review when he posted only an excerpt, because that excerpt was the only part of the review that we were discussing. To sum it up, he posted a part of the review that had to do with what we were talking about, so why go read the rest of a review if it is not about what we are discussing?

Quote

That review is just trying to bash a film because they took it the wrong way.

That quote, in the context of your rant, made it seem like you were bashing the entire review. If you have read the review, you will see the following quote right before Layer 2:

Quote

The concept of a dream within a dream is an important one for Inception. Cobb and his cohorts construct dreams like nesting dolls to confuse their subjects. Wake up, you're still dreaming. Wake up again, and you may be dreaming still. Each dream-layer accesses a deeper level of subconscious.

A proper critique, then, demands the same treatment.

Layer 1: Artistically, Inception is one of the year's most provocative, compelling films. The story's the thing here—so strong that the film's topnotch cast and stunning visual effects serve it without overwhelming it. Directed by The Dark Knight's Christopher Nolan, Inception aspires to art without relinquishing its popcorn-munching bona fides. It's a film that'll likely resonate with critics and moviegoers alike.

Also note the quote again that you ranted about:

Quote

So I can't help but wonder how someone who is already toying with the idea of ending it all would view this film—if they might look through the eyes of a "suicidal" character and find their own tragic longings mirrored there.

The whole point of your rant seems to be centered on the reviewer just thinking out load. He was not saying that it will happen but that he was wondering if it would happen.

Quote

Quote
Also, some people do go do something fun one last time before committing suicide.
Ok you are comparing a Skillet concert to going and see a movie...

That was in response to this line:

Quote

Anyone contemplating suicide would not say, "Hey it's a friday night, I'm gonna go see a movie."

I was trying to point out that some people, before going through with it, do one last fun thing. So it would be possible that they would go see a movie before they do it. I wasn't trying to compare a concert to a movie.

Regardless if the movie was meant to be a dream or not, watching two people putting there heads onto a train track while a train is coming is still something I chose not to watch.

Please know that I am not trying to get people to not watch the movie. I'm just getting tired of coming to these message boards (which most people claim to be Christians) bashing a Christian site that is meant to help other believers keep their mind clear of junk and for parents to know whats in a movie before they let their kids see it.

Mr.Hiatus · « **Reply #60 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:36:00 AM »

Quote

Okay then....
This is a direct quote from focus on the Family's review of Inception
Layer 2: Inception's content centers on its suicide-fueled violence—which trivializes the act of self-annihilation. In doing so, we're forced to a place where, looking through the eyes of some characters, suicide appears to be a convenient, beneficial out from a reality you don't want anymore: Let's scrap this world, because the real one—presumably a better one—lies beyond. In this ethos, suicide isn't an act of desperation or despair, but one of hope and promise. So I can't help but wonder how someone who is already toying with the idea of ending it all would view this film—if they might look through the eyes of a "suicidal" character and find their own tragic longings mirrored there.

This is your review you posted. In no where did you say, hey go read the rest of this review. And then you asked questions based on this excerpt of the review, meaning (to me) that the rest of the review was insignificant to the discussion.

Quote

I was trying to point out that some people, before going through with it, do one last fun thing. So it would be possible that they would go see a movie before they do it. I wasn't trying to compare a concert to a movie.

Well we think very differently, because I think someone contemplating suicide does not go out to a movie before hand. But that's just me.

Quote

Regardless if the movie was meant to be a dream or not, watching two people putting there heads onto a train track while a train is coming is still something I chose not to watch.

This is completely out of context. The train wreck was a kick to get her out of Limbo, not suicide.

Quote

I'm just getting tired of coming to these message boards (which most people claim to be Christians) bashing a Christian site that is meant to help other believers keep their mind clear of junk and for parents to know whats in a movie before they let their kids see it.

I'm tired of people going to extremes and not letting things go. I think some review site, ANY NOT JUST CHRISTIAN, go too in depth sometimes when they find it offending and take parts of the movie out of context.
/end bash /end rant

JSB23 · « **Reply #61 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:46:26 AM »

Quote from: Ironica on August 06, 2010, 12:24:47 AM

Please know that I am not trying to get people to not watch the movie. I'm just getting tired of coming to these message boards (which most people claim to be Christians) bashing a Christian site that is meant to help other believers keep their mind clear of junk and for parents to know whats in a movie before they let their kids see it.

I tired of christian sites twisting fact to suit their needs

@ Rawr
You should find these interesting
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1375666/fullcredits#cast look at the stuff about the kids
http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2010/08/inception_costume_designer_rev.html

@ Alex
so you're saying Cobb wanted to be separated from his wife and kids?

Rawrlolsauce! · « **Reply #62 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:54:06 AM »

Two different actors played Michelle in Full House, but I don't think that she was noticeably different episode to episode >:c

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #63 on:** August 06, 2010, 12:56:54 AM »

Quote from: Mr.Hiatus on August 06, 2010, 12:36:00 AM

I think some review site, ANY NOT JUST CHRISTIAN, go too in depth sometimes when they find it offending and take parts of the movie out of context.

I don't think it's going too in depth to warn parents that suicide is being portrayed in a movie. That is something that they deserve to know.

Quote from: JSB23 on August 06, 2010, 12:46:26 AM

I tired of christian sites twisting fact to suit their needs

I'm tired of Christian teens twisting the Christian worldview to suit their desires.

Red Dragon Thorn · « **Reply #64 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:01:18 AM »

I'm tired of Christian adults deciding that their interpretation of Christianity forms the exact worldview that said Christian teens should be following.

I mean, c'mon on, didn't we just have this debate?

COUNTER_SNIPER · « **Reply #65 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:04:34 AM »

Ya know, I honestly forgot about the train stuff, jumping off the building thing, etc... But you wanna know why that is? Because it's a movie, I'm old enough to discern what is true and what is false, and I'm not a fan of the movie. The movie has an "R" rating, which means it's not for kiddies. Seriously, there's more to be concerned about in the Lion King (I like that movie) and other animated cartoons that are rated PG and are geared for children. Everyone has their own convictions about what God wants them to/not do, and it's up to each one of us to listen and follow our convictions (With caution). If you are young in the faith and haven't spiritually matured, you should be very cautious about what you view.

Oh my goodness, I got WAY serious up there :O

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #66 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:10:42 AM »

Quote from: JSB23 on August 06, 2010, 12:46:26 AM

Quote from: Ironica on August 06, 2010, 12:24:47 AM
Please know that I am not trying to get people to not watch the movie. I'm just getting tired of coming to these message boards (which most people claim to be Christians) bashing a Christian site that is meant to help other believers keep their mind clear of junk and for parents to know whats in a movie before they let their kids see it.
I tired of christian sites twisting fact to suit their needs

@ Rawr
You should find these interesting
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1375666/fullcredits#cast look at the stuff about the kids
http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2010/08/inception_costume_designer_rev.html

@ Alex
so you're saying Cobb wanted to be separated from his wife and kids?

To be frank, it's pretty clear no matter what anyone says you are going to hold to your (incorrect) viewpoint, but here we go anyway.

1. Christian review sites exist because Hollywood does not think about Christian parenting when they make movies. If your young child wants to see a movie, you not privy to the exact details of the movie. In a world where many movies push the limits of violence, sexual content (without nudity), and objectionable (to Christians) content, or simply present a non-Christian or anti-Christian viewpoint, parents are forced to rely on sites like PluggedIn, who use vast resources to review every major motion picture to find objectionable content. The situation they are in is simply. They can not sign off on a movie unless there is NOTHING in the movie that ANYONE will objectionable. They will mention ANYTHING that ANYONE COULD POTENTIALLY find objectionable. However, they are not necessarily saying that they personally find the movie objectionable, that you should not see the movie, or that the movie is evil . It is simply in there best interest to point out anything that could possibly be objectionable to their target audience, Christian parents.

2. I am not saying that Cobb wanted to be seperated, I am saying he wanted to be together with them. However, who is to say that he did not end up choosing to be with them in a dream state? Nothing in the movie predicates a belief that the ending was in a state of our reality (if anything, it encourages you to believe it is in a dream state). By not showing the top standing or falling (thus establishing reality in the viewer's eyes) Nolan is saying that reality is what you make of it. Something that is real to you is not necessary real to anyone else, but if it is real to you, than you will be alright.

Quote from: COUNTER_SNIPER on August 06, 2010, 01:04:34 AM

Ya know, I honestly forgot about the train stuff, jumping off the building thing, etc... But you wanna know why that is? Because it's a movie, I'm old enough to discern what is true and what is false, and I'm not a fan of the movie. The movie has an "R" rating, which means it's not for kiddies. Seriously, there's more to be concerned about in the Lion King (I like that movie) and other animated cartoons that are rated PG and are geared for children. Everyone has their own convictions about what God wants them to/not do, and it's up to each one of us to listen and follow our convictions (With caution). If you are young in the faith and haven't spiritually matured, you should be very cautious about what you view.

Oh my goodness, I got WAY serious up there :O

It is PG-13.Saying that the Lion King has more objectionable content than Inception is absolutely ridiculous. Does the Lion King reek of partial animalism and extreme environmentalism as well as possible pantheism? Perhaps. But it is extremely deep within the context of the movie and is not accessible unless you are a mature, deep thinking individual. Meanwhile, Inception puts blatant suicide directly in front of you (in the context of a dream) wihtin the folds of a complex movie that is literally probably impossible to comprehend as a full entity. Which one do you think is more objectionable:

On screen suicide vs. implied ideology?

Ironica · « **Reply #67 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:16:11 AM »

Wow CS. Quick, make a joke post

.

Also, its pg13 (if it was R, I wouldn't have wanted to see it)

COUNTER_SNIPER · « **Reply #68 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:27:40 AM »

There was an AND OTHER ANIMATED MOVIES added to that. Children are more impressionable and thus, are susceptible to influence. PG-13, R, whatever. My point still stands (sorta). How does a point stand? It's a point...?! I'm scarred for life because of the Lion King 1 and 1/2... jk jk

Man, where's a joke when you need one... Oh wait, I'm right here!!

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #69 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:30:20 AM »

Quote from: COUNTER_SNIPER on August 06, 2010, 01:27:40 AM

There was an AND OTHER ANIMATED MOVIES added to that. Children are more impressionable and thus, are susceptible to influence.

Children are susceptible to more things, but if they don't understand the subtle message, than they can't be impressioned by it.

COUNTER_SNIPER · « **Reply #70 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:35:27 AM »

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on August 06, 2010, 01:30:20 AM

Quote from: COUNTER_SNIPER on August 06, 2010, 01:27:40 AM
There was an AND OTHER ANIMATED MOVIES added to that. Children are more impressionable and thus, are susceptible to influence.

Children are susceptible to more things, but if they don't understand the subtle message, than they can't be impressioned by it.

They don't understand suicide or what bad words mean/why they're bad, so what's ya point? (I'm really not trying to start a debate.)

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #71 on:** August 06, 2010, 01:40:08 AM »

Quote from: COUNTER_SNIPER on August 06, 2010, 01:35:27 AM

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on August 06, 2010, 01:30:20 AM
Quote from: COUNTER_SNIPER on August 06, 2010, 01:27:40 AM
There was an AND OTHER ANIMATED MOVIES added to that. Children are more impressionable and thus, are susceptible to influence.

Children are susceptible to more things, but if they don't understand the subtle message, than they can't be impressioned by it.

They don't understand suicide or what bad words mean/why they're bad, so what's ya point? (I'm really not trying to start a debate.)

But they do understand violence. In primitive terms, it is concievable that a 7 year old would come out of Inception saying "maybe if I hurt myself, I will get somewhere else!". The same child will never come out of Lion King and say " I should go worship animals!" or "I should save the rainforests!" or "This tree has the same life energy as I do!".

Prof Underwood · « **Reply #72 on:** August 06, 2010, 02:20:16 AM »

Quote from: Red Dragon Thorn on August 06, 2010, 01:01:18 AM

I'm tired of Christian adults deciding that their interpretation of Christianity forms the exact worldview that said Christian teens should be following.

Do I expect all Christian teenagers to agree with my worldview on everything? No. Am I going to sit there and let a Christian teenager insult other Christians who are reviewing all these movies as a service (and perhaps even a ministry) to Christian parents out there? No.

I haven't seen this movie, so I can't comment on the movie itself. But if someone is insulting places like PluggedIn or Chrsitian Spotlight, then I believe that those resources deserve to be defended. As Alex described above, they are trying to help parents be more informed about an industry that is often purposefully anti-Christian. They should be commended, not maligned.

JSB23 · « **Reply #73 on:** August 06, 2010, 02:29:03 AM »

Quote from: Prof Underwood on August 06, 2010, 02:20:16 AM

Quote from: Red Dragon Thorn on August 06, 2010, 01:01:18 AM
I'm tired of Christian adults deciding that their interpretation of Christianity forms the exact worldview that said Christian teens should be following.
Do I expect all Christian teenagers to agree with my worldview on everything? No.

Really? could have fooled me.

Red Dragon Thorn · « **Reply #74 on:** August 06, 2010, 02:30:28 AM »

JSB (who you directly quoted) didn't insult them - He simply said that they blew the suicide out of proportion and that he was tired of them twisting the facts.

I don't think that's overly untruthful either.

EDIT:

JSB, I love you like a brother, but that was out of line.

News:

Author Topic: Inception (Potential Spoilers) (Read 18804 times)

Rawrlolsauce!

Ironica

Rawrlolsauce!

Ironica