Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Ishmael is a very interesting character in the Bible.  He was given many descendants through God's promise and provision, and there is not much in the story itself to indicate his own personal beliefs.  Some Talmudic teachings suggest Ishmael was evil but still repented, but the biblical story is unfortunately lacking in detail.

What we do know is that he became the patriarch of many nations, just like Isaac, but that he did not carry the blessing that Isaac carried to fulfill the promise to Abraham.  Also, many of the tribes founded through his descendants would become enemies of Israel in the times to come.  More likely, he would be an evil character, as there is not much basis to make him a hero and he is the patriarch of many 'villain' tribes we see later on, who opposed the Jewish God.

On his identifiers, he would certainly be Egyptian.  His mother was Egyptian, though the exact position she held is debated (some suggest she was a daughter of Pharaoh, even), and by birth he was also Egyptian.  Other sources also suggest that he married an Egyptian woman in his later years, furthering the identity he had.

tl;dr - Son of Abraham, Egyptian, EC

What if you made him start out as a hero but then turn into an evil character if Isaac enters play? Kinda like Saul/Paul but the other way around.

The likelyhood of Isaac entering play is extrememly small.

Personally I think he should be a hero.

True we don't have much info on him. But we don't know of anything explicitly wrong that he did. We also know God promised to protect Him and Hagar in the wilderness. When things looked bad for the two of them Hagar calls out to God and he comes to them.

Just because his decedents caused trouble dosent mean it was his fault either.

As too identifiers, he was of Egyptian blood but was raised in a Hebrew society, So I'd lean Egyptian but maybe give him both.

I understand your dilemma on not seeing him do anything wrong, but in those times particularly, the patriarch of the family set the religion that the descendants followed.  The fact that Isaac's family followed God and Ishmael's followed pagan gods from what we can see leads me to lean more towards the EC designation.  But this will be a controversial card, regardless.

Also don't forget "evil" seems to have a broad definition in Redemption.  Would you really call Uzzah or TAS "evil?"  Probably not, but they are still evil characters.

I guess that means your set will get two new gen Egypts