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Author Topic: Abundant Offerings  (Read 4652 times)

Offline Smokey

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Abundant Offerings
« on: September 06, 2009, 09:01:08 PM »
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Abundant Offerings
Artifact
Sa: If holder has a good king or preist in play, discard this card to force all players to shuffle X cards from hand, territory, or set-aside into draw piles.
Temple Artifact, X = Any number of cards, but cannot exceed amount of cards in holders hand.
Verse: II Chronicles 31: 9-10 - " 9 Then Hezekiah questioned the priests and the Levites concerning the heaps.  10 And Azariah the chief priest, from the house of Zadok, answered him and said, “Since the people began to bring the offerings into the house of the Lord, we have had enough to eat and have plenty left, for the Lord has blessed His people; and what is left is this great abundance.”

Thoughts, Comments?
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 10:12:28 PM by Smokey »
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Offline adamfincher

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2009, 09:06:16 PM »
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op'd, especially with a sin in camp... that could be devestating with just one little camp... just get rid of all there cards...
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Offline BubbleBoy

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2009, 09:13:09 PM »
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I think it's fine. I would reword it like this, though:

"If holder has a good king or preist in play, discard this card to force all players to shuffle up to X cards from hand into draw piles.
Temple Artifact, X = the number of cards in holder's hand.

Same thing, less wordy.
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2009, 09:22:19 PM »
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Quote from: adamfincher on September 06, 2009, 09:06:16 PM
op'd, especially with a sin in camp... that could be devestating with just one little camp... just get rid of all there cards...

In Theory, if you shuffle all the cards in your opponents hand you won't have any either.

Quote from: BubbleBoy on September 06, 2009, 09:13:09 PM
I think it's fine. I would reword it like this, though:

"If holder has a good king or preist in play, discard this card to force all players to shuffle up to X cards from hand into draw piles.
Temple Artifact, X = the number of cards in holder's hand.

Same thing, less wordy.

Point taken
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Offline Arch Angel

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2009, 09:35:22 PM »
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I'd reword it to say...

"If holder has a good king or preist in play, discard this card to shuffle X cards from hand into draw pile. All opponents must do the same.
Temple Artifact, X = Number of cards holder chooses."

so that your opponent can't decide to shuffle 0 cards (due to the up to)

edit: lawl epic typo
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 09:43:21 PM by Arch Angel »
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2009, 09:40:05 PM »
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Quote from: Arch Angel on September 06, 2009, 09:35:22 PM
I'd reword it to say...

"If holder has a good king or preist in play, discard this card to shuffle X cards from hand into draw pile. All opponents must do the same.
Temple Artifact, X = Number of cards opponent chooses."

so that your opponent can't decide to shuffle 0 cards (due to the up to)

I put it back the way it originally was... STOP NITPICKING MY WORDING ...
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2009, 09:49:52 PM »
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You did ask for thoughts and comments, which are being provided. Being nitpicky is important for card development, as we all know not all cards work the way they were designed to work because of wording.

Also, I think adamfincher's argument has merit. It would be much easier to set up a SitC combo with this card, since getting rid of Words of Discouragement wouldn't suffice. Instead, you're using an Artifact that can't be interrupted. Since you get to keep the cards you draw, and your opponent would have to put them on the bottom of his deck, there's no balance.

How about this instead:

"If you have a good king or priest in play, discard this card to shuffle X cards from hand or territory into draw pile to force all opponents to do the same.
X=Any number up to the number of cards in holder's hand."

That way, they can get rid of any SitC's in their territory.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 10:13:42 PM by Professoralstad »
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2009, 10:11:14 PM »
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Quote from: Professoralstad on September 06, 2009, 09:49:52 PM
You did ask for thoughts and comments, which are being provided. Being nitpicky is important for card development, as we all know not all cards work the way they were designed to work because of wording.

Also, I think adamfincher's argument has merit. It would be much even easier to set up a SitC combo with this card, since getting rid of Words of Discouragement wouldn't suffice. Instead, you're using an Artifact that can't be interrupted. Since you get to keep the cards you draw, and your opponent would have to put them on the bottom of his deck, there's no balance.

How about this instead:

"If you have a good king or priest in play, discard this card to shuffle X cards from hand or territory into draw pile to force all opponents to do the same.
X=Any number up to the number of cards in holder's hand."

That way, they can get rid of any SitC's in their territory.

My wording was originally fine, but Bubbleboy suggested I change it for wordiness, then that created a loop-hole... thats why I was upset but anyways

I like your idea, thank you for your input  ;D
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Offline BubbleBoy

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2009, 11:16:37 PM »
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Well I see the point, but the identifier is still a bit wordy. How about try "X ≤ the number of cards in your hand." ;D
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2009, 11:17:37 PM »
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Quote from: BubbleBoy on September 06, 2009, 11:16:37 PM
Well I see the point, but the identifier is still a bit wordy. How about try "X ≤ the number of cards in your hand." ;D

Its not being printed (yet  ::)) I'm leaving it as is.
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Offline uthminister [BR]

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2009, 11:28:05 AM »
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What if "X = the number of good kings or priests in your territory"?
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2009, 11:29:34 AM »
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Quote from: uthminister [BR] on September 07, 2009, 11:28:05 AM
What if "X = the number of good kings or priests in your territory"?

That was a suggestion someone else already made, I think that the card is more useful if the number of shuffled cards in the holder's choice though.
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Offline uthminister [BR]

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2009, 11:31:48 AM »
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Yeah, but that is what makes it overpowered. Maybe another trigger for them to shuffle their hands into their draw piles would be for you to set aside your good kings or priests for a certain number of turns...
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2009, 11:35:33 AM »
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Quote from: uthminister [BR] on September 07, 2009, 11:31:48 AM
Yeah, but that is what makes it overpowered. Maybe another trigger for them to shuffle their hands into their draw piles would be for you to set aside your good kings or priests for a certain number of turns...

I don't see how that would make it any less overpowered, as the card lets you shuffle from set-aside.
I also don't see how this card is any more overpowered than ANB or any of the new prophet's shuffle abilities.
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Offline uthminister [BR]

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2009, 12:54:54 PM »
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Never mind...obviously you are not putting this up for suggestions...good card idea though... 8)
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Abundant Offerings
« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2009, 12:59:47 PM »
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Quote from: uthminister [BR] on September 07, 2009, 12:54:54 PM
Never mind...obviously you are not putting this up for suggestions...good card idea though... 8)

I'm up for suggestions, I just wanted to know your thought process behind it.
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