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Bills T2 only local had about the same number of players as T2-2P did at Nationals!  I will say that it's a little easier to do well when Justin isn't there to stomp you.

We are working on the date and are making sure Justin could make it. He was one of the reason we started the tournament. To give our MN good type 2 players some good competition.

I think it's cool that the top 3 decks (Clift, Kirk, and Tyler) were all at the EC Regional tournament this year.  So for all you guys out there who want a heads up on the top decks in T2 next year, remember to come to the EC Regional tournament

I'm hoping a couple of those EC region boys could join us next year. Its a great mid season nationals tune up.

I don't know if he'll be able to do it again next year but Bill was very generous in helping cover my travel expenses in addition to offering free lodging for those who wanted to spend the night.

Our church is pretty good about letting people stay overnight so that shouldn't be a problem.  We also have showers and mattresses available to use.

grapes of wrath does hurt the deck b/c its another dominant you have to get rid of.

i remember at one time tyler would put glory of the lord in his deck on top of all of the others just so i couldnt take them all:)

There are literally half a dozen ways to Combat the SitC deck.  The problem is that no one plays with them (or no one plays them correctly against a SiTC deck): 
Pot of Manna,
Wasting Diseases,
More than 5 good Doms, 
jerusalem Tower,
Rain becomes Dust,
Gifts of the Magi (with another art like Lampstand up in the Temple, good luck putting all those cards up on top of my drawpile  )
CoM,
HHI,
I think there is a covenant that I cant find now that stops heros from fighting heros and EC's from fighting EC's, that would stop Cup of Wrath. 
Gabriel
Hidden Treasures  (I know Clift says that you should go after the Word of Discouragement, but with High Places, I think it just becomes so much easier to play the SiTC and those are the problematic cards.  That is the Lock and if you dont get the Lock, you can deal with the Word of Discouragement.  There are only 5 of them in there)

I am Grace if it is a Soft Lock.  Also Forts like The Darkness are very problematic because if you can band to their EC's when they come for a rescue, you wipe them out.  No SiTC deck uses Wall that I know of. 

Pot of Manna, whoever is willing to waste a card in a deck, go ahead... good luck gettin 1 in 100 up early enough... unless you want to waste 3...
Wasting Diseases, eh... this one could pose a problem...
More than 5 good Doms,  hahaha. worthless doms don't do you any good outside of playing this deck. Glory and HT? worthless.
jerusalem Tower, again, try to get it up...
Rain becomes Dust, who uses speed in T2 other than this deck? a few draws maybe, but not speed.
Gifts of the Magi (with another art like Lampstand up in the Temple, good luck putting all those cards up on top of my drawpile  ) good luck getting 3 out of 100 cards... that fast
CoM, I discard NJ. big deal.
HHI, I think I saw a Cov. of David... maybe not.
I think there is a covenant that I cant find now that stops heros from fighting heros and EC's from fighting EC's, that would stop Cup of Wrath. not that I know of. Pot of Manna...
Gabriel/Hidden/Amasai if you're looking for it... and even then, it will be difficult.

The problem isn't that this deck can't be stopped... it's that if you don't draw one of the counters in the first 3-5 turns, gg sir.

exactly.

Quote from: crustpope on August 04, 2009, 12:30:32 PM

Pot of Manna, whoever is willing to waste a card in a deck, go ahead... good luck gettin 1 in 100 up early enough... unless you want to waste 3...
Wasting Diseases, eh... this one could pose a problem...
More than 5 good Doms,  hahaha. worthless doms don't do you any good outside of playing this deck. Glory and HT? worthless.
jerusalem Tower, again, try to get it up...
Rain becomes Dust, who uses speed in T2 other than this deck? a few draws maybe, but not speed.
Gifts of the Magi (with another art like Lampstand up in the Temple, good luck putting all those cards up on top of my drawpile   ) good luck getting 3 out of 100 cards... that fast
CoM, I discard NJ. big deal.
HHI, I think I saw a Cov. of David... maybe not.
I think there is a covenant that I cant find now that stops heros from fighting heros and EC's from fighting EC's, that would stop Cup of Wrath. not that I know of. Pot of Manna...
Gabriel/Hidden/Amasai if you're looking for it... and even then, it will be difficult.

The problem is that now will all the side battle cards you probably SHOULD consiter putting a few cups of manna (if not the entire POT) into each deck if you dont use side battles to do your thang.    I hate the hand limit rule and hope if goes down in inglorious flames this season, but even so, I already have ideas how to make this deck viable without all the draws.  And many of thes cards can still be used (and should be use) to counter this deck and many others.

btw a good sitc deck does not use NJ or SoG to d/c CoM and HHI is a good art that should easily fit in most decks. HT is not a wasted Dom in type 2 ( you just have to play it before the battle begins)  and if you inlude HHI, J-tower, I am mercy, Gifts and either Gabe/ammasai/Treasures depending upon y or deck you should have no porblem pulling one or multiple of the stops.

Everyone acts like chiken little saying the sky is falling.  It's just that you all havent been exposed to this deck.  The more you play it, the more you will be able to beat it.

The problem is that now will all the side battle cards you probably SHOULD consiter putting a few cups of manna (if not the entire POT) into each deck if you dont use side battles to do your thang.    I hate the hand limit rule and hope if goes down in inglorious flames this season, but even so, I already have ideas how to make this deck viable without all the draws.  And many of thes cards can still be used (and should be use) to counter this deck and many others.

btw a good sitc deck does not use NJ or SoG to d/c CoM and HHI is a good art that should easily fit in most decks. HT is not a wasted Dom in type 2 ( you just have to play it before the battle begins)  and if you inlude HHI, J-tower, I am mercy, Gifts and either Gabe/ammasai/Treasures depending upon y or deck you should have no porblem pulling one or multiple of the stops.

Everyone acts like chiken little saying the sky is falling.  It's just that you all havent been exposed to this deck.  The more you play it, the more you will be able to beat it.

sure, there's lots of side battle cards... but I've seen very few in T2, other than this deck, and a few Sword of the Lords in a green deck. I won't put in Cup of Manna... if you can convince alot of others to, then congrats to you.

I thought the hand limit rule was just in consideration?

make a deck viable against a SitC deck and other decks? good luck. a lot of cards will be wasted.

HHI is a good art, and easy to fit in. but why not discard NJ? what's it gonna do for you if you're ready to shut them down?

most T2 games there are PLENTY of souls to rescue... just not always right away. HT is a very scarce card in T2-2P. in Multi, it's slightly more common.

I am Mercy would be a waste. it'll be strictly for when you play a SitC deck, which aren't at all common anyway...

Gifts won't really stop it... just delay it. it can also be DoN'd. as I said earlier.

I don't think it's broken, just very difficult to beat. and if you can, congrats. but it's not worth putting in all those cards, IMO.

Quote from: Ring Wraith on August 06, 2009, 06:35:51 PM

sure, there's lots of side battle cards... but I've seen very few in T2, other than this deck, and a few Sword of the Lords in a green deck. I won't put in Cup of Manna... if you can convince alot of others to, then congrats to you.

I saw more side battle cards at Nats in T2 2P alone than most Redemption players have seen in their life.  I might have had a fighting chance during one of my losses, as well as won a different game by a better margin, if I'd decided to include a couple copies of Pot of Manna.

interesting. although, Nats was in Cali...

Quote from: sk on August 06, 2009, 06:42:41 PM

Quote from: Ring Wraith on August 06, 2009, 06:35:51 PM

sure, there's lots of side battle cards... but I've seen very few in T2, other than this deck, and a few Sword of the Lords in a green deck. I won't put in Cup of Manna... if you can convince alot of others to, then congrats to you.

I saw more side battle cards at Nats in T2 2P alone than most Redemption players have seen in their life.  I might have had a fighting chance during one of my losses, as well as won a different game by a better margin, if I'd decided to include a couple copies of Pot of Manna.

interesting. although, Nats was in Cali...

Both side battle players were non-Californians.

Quote from: lightningninja on August 06, 2009, 09:08:04 PM

Wraith, gifts of the magi completely shuts this down. If you also have that many cards in your hand, words of discouragement does nothing to you.

and what do you think they'll get to do with all those cards? you just end your turn, and do it next turn, when they have no deck.

Or DoN their GotM before you start playing enhancements in the evil side battle.

You cant.  if they cant play dominants because your enhancement SA's have to complete, then you cant play dominants to stop them and that includes DoN.  So they will jsut keep one of hte many Good Dom's they drew in their hand while you play 5 worthless WoD and then when they are done, even if they do DoN your Gifts, just make sure to put a Good Dom on top to reveal and place on bottom to scatter those SitC to the four corners of their discard pile.

It's really interesting that you're trying to enlighten me on how to play this deck.  

Obviously you'd have to use initiative, not 2KHorses, to begin playing in the side battle so you have a window to use DoN.  You're correct that the opponent would get to play Dominants too.

You make a good point though.  Overconfident people think they know how to beat this deck when really they don't understand intricately how it works.