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Quote from: Kor on September 20, 2018, 07:42:35 AM...otherwise Asahel shouldn’t work either.Asahel doesn't work because he specifies "opponent's male human", unlike Ehud (RA) who simply says "from opponent's territory". I've only used gold Judges with Canaanites myself (because AUTO) and just assumed Asahel had the same wording as Ehud. My bad. Jael still works though.
...otherwise Asahel shouldn’t work either.
Judean Mediums banded to new KoT. An auto-block guarantee.
Quote from: Watchman on September 20, 2018, 01:01:05 PMJudean Mediums banded to new KoT. An auto-block guarantee.Assuming they have no regardless of protection or Eternal Inheritance.
"You may take a Canaanite from Reserve and give it to opponent's territory to draw 1."The benefit (draw 1) only happens if the conditions before the to are met. Therefore, you must both A) Take a Canaanite from Reserve and B) give it to opponent's territory to C) draw 1. If you cannot fulfil either A or B, then C doesn't occur. That's what I would say, but I'm prepared to be proven wrong.
Quote from: Kevinthedude on September 20, 2018, 01:07:23 PMQuote from: Watchman on September 20, 2018, 01:01:05 PMJudean Mediums banded to new KoT. An auto-block guarantee.Assuming they have no regardless of protection or Eternal Inheritance.Or NT heroes...
Quote from: ChristianSoldier on September 20, 2018, 01:40:44 AMUnless I'm completely missing the point of this definition, if seems to me that it Foreign Sword would work on a character Given by King of Tyrus.The portion of the REG you quoted isn't the key to determining if Foreign Sword works in this scenario. The following is found in the REG Glossary under Opponent.QuoteSeveral cards in Redemption® refer to “opponent’s cards” (e.g., opponent’s Heroes). For a card to be considered an “opponent’s card”, that player must be the owner of the card as well as have control of the card. An “opponent’s” ability is an ability on an “opponent’s” card.
Unless I'm completely missing the point of this definition, if seems to me that it Foreign Sword would work on a character Given by King of Tyrus.
Several cards in Redemption® refer to “opponent’s cards” (e.g., opponent’s Heroes). For a card to be considered an “opponent’s card”, that player must be the owner of the card as well as have control of the card. An “opponent’s” ability is an ability on an “opponent’s” card.
OwnerWhen a reference is made to the owner of a card, it means the player from whose deck or Reserve the card originated
Quote from: Master Q on September 20, 2018, 12:23:10 PM"You may take a Canaanite from Reserve and give it to opponent's territory to draw 1."The benefit (draw 1) only happens if the conditions before the to are met. Therefore, you must both A) Take a Canaanite from Reserve and B) give it to opponent's territory to C) draw 1. If you cannot fulfil either A or B, then C doesn't occur. That's what I would say, but I'm prepared to be proven wrong.You have to give to draw, but you don't have to give. You can gain a Canaanite or the drawn card.
Quote from: Gabe on September 20, 2018, 11:37:30 AMQuote from: ChristianSoldier on September 20, 2018, 01:40:44 AMUnless I'm completely missing the point of this definition, if seems to me that it Foreign Sword would work on a character Given by King of Tyrus.The portion of the REG you quoted isn't the key to determining if Foreign Sword works in this scenario. The following is found in the REG Glossary under Opponent.QuoteSeveral cards in Redemption® refer to “opponent’s cards” (e.g., opponent’s Heroes). For a card to be considered an “opponent’s card”, that player must be the owner of the card as well as have control of the card. An “opponent’s” ability is an ability on an “opponent’s” card.Yes, but I knew that. I was just showing that according to the rules (at least as I read them(, once a player has Permanent Control of a card, they are considered an owner.QuoteOwnerWhen a reference is made to the owner of a card, it means the player from whose deck or Reserve the card originatedCombined with the definition I already said about Permanent Control treating the card as coming from Your Deck, that means that once you gain Permanent Control of a card you are treated as the owner, so Foreign Sword should work. Or did I misinterpret something?
You can't change ownership. Each of the 3 definitions of control (control, temporary control, permanent control) could be argued to change ownership - permanent control is just the bluntest. That should be clarified with the next REG update.
If a player has permanent control of a card, then he can treat that card as if it came from his deck.
So, just to clarify, by the logic of have to take from Reserve and give to opponent to draw, Samuel should be able to search for David or King Saul and NOT put in play in order to not draw then, right? I've heard that's not the case because "and put in play" is a default condition or something but that doesn't really track with KoT then. Or is that just considered old wording now?
I really want Doomed Canaanites to be a real card PLEASE!
This is not an actual card, but a modified version of the black "Doomed" character.
Samuel has one "cost" ability (a search which directs you where to put the card so it cannot default to hand) making it one optional ability that results in a mandatory benefit.KoT has an optional take to hand and an optional give to opponent (two optional "costs"). If both costs are paid you then gain a benefit.
If we printed KoT a few years ago he'd probably be worded similar to Samuel. But since we use "take" now to get cards from locations you don't control (which includes a search but isn't governed by the same rules as search) the rules that apply to Samuel don't apply to KoT.
So I don't know Canaanites but is there many ways to get back your EC that you give to your opponent? seems like a large cost to pay for a draw 1 if there isn't a few viable ways to get them back
Quote from: TheJaylor on September 21, 2018, 09:08:59 PMSo, just to clarify, by the logic of have to take from Reserve and give to opponent to draw, Samuel should be able to search for David or King Saul and NOT put in play in order to not draw then, right? I've heard that's not the case because "and put in play" is a default condition or something but that doesn't really track with KoT then. Or is that just considered old wording now?Samuel has one "cost" ability (a search which directs you where to put the card so it cannot default to hand) making it one optional ability that results in a mandatory benefit.
