Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Now that TxP has introduced solid counters to remove some of its "free souls" status, and people have begin to build decks to counter it, I like it.  It now takes a bit of work to keep it going, so it's not a "must use" strategy anymore.

FWIW, there's a 15-page thread discussing TGT here.

with MKC.  TGT is so insanely overpowered, even with counters.  It was a big mistake.

I like TGT. It is fun to play against and fun to play with. I played a TGT deck a regionals a few months ago and it wasn't bad but of course he didn't have all of the right cards to pull it off. And I didn't have any cards that I needed for my deck like DON Wall and stuff like that lol

I played in a tournament today, my deck has about 6 stand alone characters. The only game I won was against Garden Tomb it seemed like -.-

i agree. didnt the t12p national champ deck use a standalone defense? 'nuff said.

now even more powerful with ioj/ds to stop tgt.

and gomer too...i think the new gomer definately qualifies as a standalone. makes that kot 13/15!

TGT = NPE.

worse mistake redemption has ever made.

But there are counters! How dare you make the accusation that Redemption has made a mistake. Redemption DOES not make mistakes.  Do you want me to list the counters? Their are to many counters to list. Your just mad that you cant play your precious standalone defense. Every one knows that a solid color defence shuts down TGT.

Quote from: Master KChief on September 19, 2009, 01:11:17 AM

TGT = NPE.

worse mistake redemption has ever made.

But there are counters! How dare you make the accusation that Redemption has made a mistake. Redemption DOES not make mistakes.  Do you want me to list the counters? Their are to many counters to list. Your just mad that you cant play your precious standalone defense. Every one knows that a solid color defence shuts down TGT.

Something to consider though, and it is why I asked the question in the first place.  Having a card or an ability to counter something doesn't imply the capability to be able to play it.  Many of the counters Pre-Texp were all enhancements.  If you can't block then enhancements mean little.  Having played with the game for a long time, if you notice before Priests, there never was the ability to discard an NT fortress card.  Then spreading mildew was printed, but again, still an enhancement.  I think the power of the fortress comes not from its effect, but the lack of ability to counter it.

I reach back to hallowed antiquity to after warriors was released, but before C/D decks were out.  FBN offenses were the only successful offense.  Why?  There was no effective way to play against them.  Holy of Holies was first printed in C/D decks, and it is why I ended taking second in my first National tournament in t12p.  My opponent, the venerable Tim Maly, had a deck with Ira, Beniah, Shamhuth, Moses, TSA and then all the 3/4 power enhancements.  At that time, the only way to turn those abilities off was with the set aside Tower in Pale Green.  Now my question to you is simply this:  There was a counter available then, so what was the need to print HoH, or CBN abilities, or anything else that came after it?  That's the same logic your using in your arguement saying there are plenty of counters for TGT in the format around.

The reason I think TGT was a mistake is not that it is too OP'D.  It is that it is too easy.  TGT allows anyone to skip deck planning (not that all TGT decks aren't planned, but you get the idea.)

I think the major problem here is simply that there are decks that don't take into consideration how players utilize the capabilities of TGT to amplify cards that have been played for years.  AoCP is not a new card by far, and neither is ET.  To be honest here, I have not played much recently, but a couple observations.  TGT is a card that needs to be accounted for in tournament play.  If your not playing it, you need to be able to beat it, and even if you are playing it, I would suggest you be able to defend against it.  Also, keep in mind that TGT works both ways for both players.  I think something that would be a great addition to many decks is simply add one or two of the applicable characters to your mix in your deck, and take advantage of its abilities.  If your playing white, purple, red, blue or green, add in one or more characters in the deck.  One particular deck this works well in is a genesis deck, where you can add mary magdelene into your mix.  Yes she does shut down your genesis abilities on some level, but if the TGT deck isn't setup to defend its own TGT, it seems a simple way to use it to your advantage.

Another way to help would be pick defenses that have protection forts.  Egyptians and Syrians are both incredible cultures that can protect themselves.  Granted, conversion hits Syrians and capture hits Egyptians, but you can support those cards with adding a single artifact to your deck for both.  (Alter of Dagon for Syrians, Blue Tassels for Egyptians)  Something else to consider, Blue Tassels seems a wonderful answer to the Women as Snares problem.  Granted most of these suggestion are for defense, but consider this:  If your opponent is not able to win the game, you are unable to lose the game.