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when you playin kony

Today at NC Regionals two players piloted this offense. There were games it got a really good draw and games where it stalled and the opponent was able to keep it in check. I judged so I had an outside perspective. It seems to me that when piloted by a good player it does really well against people that they will probably beat anyway (5-0) but when facing another top player it's much less likely to work.

I played it to see if the hype was real - This is a spot on assessment

5-0 kony vs ems moses

Spoiler (hover to show)

other side

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can't band with spirit (prevented) asa doesn't really matter and isn't big enough. no confusion due to self control. protected from scattered, fearfulness, and they are prevented. protected from martyr. put joy on peter for cbn heals.

turn 4 victory turn 8 total

Is this the same deck list every time?

Essentially it's the same thing with the same performance with slight modifications as I'm still finding an optimal exact list

Quote from: Gabe on July 08, 2017, 04:33:49 PM

Today at NC Regionals two players piloted this offense. There were games it got a really good draw and games where it stalled and the opponent was able to keep it in check. I judged so I had an outside perspective. It seems to me that when piloted by a good player it does really well against people that they will probably beat anyway (5-0) but when facing another top player it's much less likely to work.

On the other hand this enter archetype is brand new and highly experimental. Both of us were playing the same general idea of the deck but with different philosophies of how to run it (full speed with almost no defense vs a bit slower start but a substantial defense). Neither of the decks were even close to optimal and much more testing needs to be done. The deck certainly isn't going to blow out Nats but I do think it's possible to find a highly competitive build of the deck.

this is the first roj deck i have found to consistently 5-0 in testing

So when fully loaded, what does stop this?

Assuming it was loaded with Ram's Horn up, with Peace, enough toss ammo and without Peace, CBP regardless of protection. Large bands theoretically work but there are a ton of ways to deal with that such as Great White Throne, Christ's Triumph if the band chain has unique characters in it, Eternal Inheritance, etc.

The way you beat the deck isn't stopping it once it's loaded, it's disrupting it from setting up or if its the full yolo combo version, racing to 5 souls.

I think this deck is good in type 1. JD will get the optimal deck list and then thenoffense can't be stopped. It just depends on how consistent it is and if your CoL is hidden in your deck with a bad draw or if they can disrupt him early on then I don't see this deck being able to recover. If this deck keeps beating everyone 5-0 people will seriously start considering it for nationals. Since the optimal version might not be made yet, this deck might not see play at nats sadly.

The Kony will be built, we'll make Mexico pay for it, and The Kony will be played at Nationals.

Unless something else pops up out of nowhere I'll be running this at Nats as well if for no other reason than it's extraordinarily fun to play.

I haven't gotten to try it yet, but just the thought of it is fun haha

I find the fact that a combo deck is competitive exciting! It's been a long time since that has been true in Redemption. We've been trying to slowly and carefully add pieces to the game to allow combo players to have their day. It's tricky because you don't want combo to be dominating and there's a very fine line. But viable combo deck is an important part of a healthy meta.

I appreciate you want combo to be viable (I am primarily a combo player in other CCGs) but Children is not a combo deck in the true sense of the word as it relates to the three archetypes (aggro, control, and combo). The plan of a combo deck is to delay the game until all the pieces of the combo can be assembled then win the game using the assembled pieces in a way that doesn't give the opponent a opportunity to disrupt it. This is why combo decks usually beat control decks. Control decks win by disrupting the opponent and keeping themselves from losing until they either burn through 100% opponent's resources or win through a nearly unstoppable victory condition only possible very late in a game. Control decks usually beat aggro, who's game plan is to apply a enormous amount of pressure as early as possible in order to win before the opponent can set up whatever they are trying to do. Whether an aggro deck wins or loses is decided by whether the opponent can find an answer to the initial burst of pressure or not.

The Children of Light deck is an aggro deck. There are many opportunities to interact with it early on (As you saw at the tournament, top players were able to disrupt it pretty consistently) which disqualifies it from being a combo deck. It builds up a massive amount of early pressure, basically vomiting your deck onto the table as quickly as possible, but if the opponent can find an answer to the single threat early, it just automatically loses. These are classic characteristics of an aggro deck.

Combo decks aren't viable in Redemption not for the lack of combo oriented cards, but because of the nature of how the game is won. No matter how you slice it, you have to make multiple attacks and win multiple rescues over multiple turns. This gives the opponent far too many opportunities to react for a true combo deck to exist. The only combo deck that has ever existed to my knowledge in Redemption is the infamous combo combo congo that utilized pre-errata A New Beginning to win the game in a single turn. That is what a true combo deck is. Children of Light is an aggro deck that applies heavy early pressure through the use of a combo of several specific cards, but absolutely does not belong to the Combo Archetype.

I hope to one day see a card printed in the style that Eye On It was going to be when it was planned as an enabler for alt-rescue conditions. If I remember the spoiled versions of that card correctly, some of them would have allowed for the building of a true combo archetype deck.

Kony is good to beat Delenda with (T2)

or epic toss battles and battle extension